Religion: Justifactions

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by DÛke, Feb 13, 2003.

  1. Bob Idiot

    Man, I really really hate fundamentalists.
    It's kind of funny to read how pathetic those links are. Those racist idiots in the "rock=SATAN!" link are just sad. "Drumming comes from african origins, and since we're all crazy baptist southernors, we know that blacks are evil, evil, satan worshipping beings. YEE-HAW!"

    KILL THEM. KILL THEM KILL THEM. KILL. THEM.

    We shbould go on a worlwide crusade to rid the world of morons. Bush is goin' down first.
  2. Shiro Time Devourer I have returned!

    As has happened all too often in my life outside of the CPA, my actions have been taken out of context to the point of opposing my intentions perfectly.

    Just because one lacks CS doesn't mean that severe disadvantage must be compounded by death or suffering. After all, things can happen that make one horribly stupid, and if one thinks of it as a moral sin, then by their thinking the Curse has fallen upon those who have had something make them stupid and their trouble has earned them 10 more.

    As for Bush, at least he asked Iraq for terms of peace (disarmament) before he gave the call. I hope he can make better decisions, as that is necessary; and that people can appreciate him thereby; I hope the next Canadian election doesn't go south, figuratively speaking, and deny the majority vote like the US did.
  3. Bob Idiot

    Don't feel too bad, Shiro. I just proved my own stupidity once again by not understanding you.

    Oh, and let's not bring up Bush, please. I'm tired of talking about him.
  4. Shiro Time Devourer I have returned!

    What is this? Irony Day? You also furthered my cause by saying we should stop bringing Bush up. Let this be the last Bush reference outside of the PD forum.
  5. Bob Idiot

    Look! I did it again!
  6. Aku Necromancer Headlights off

    If it is, then billions of people over the centuries have been woefully deceived, and our faith is all in vain. Do you not even believe that Jesus Christ existed?

    Faith is essentially proof without evidence. It is defined this way in both the Bible and Webster's. Biblical faith does require putting your trust where it has never been placed before. This is why it seems illogical to you. This kind of faith takes you out of your familiar circumstances. We are more comfortable functioning under what we know. So go ahead and call me stupid if you like.

    I agree, its all nonsense...
  7. Shiro Time Devourer I have returned!

    To Aku: I never said that. I said that STR proves that one can approach Christianity as much with the head as with the heart. The Gizmo quote would be the one more likely to call you stupid, which you are not in the least. I'm not saying Christianity demands stupidity or that faith w/o logic is dead. Far from it. I just said that Christianity v. Intellect is a false dilemma of the highest order.
  8. Aku Necromancer Headlights off

    Whoops…in the heat of things, I think I took your statement the wrong way. I apologize
  9. DÛke Memento Mori

    ...
    Allow me to make myself clear. What do you call a person of utter stupidity, valuelessness, thoughtlessness, opinion-oriented, lazy, and has not a "self" without having to revert to the countless inventories of attributes and values? You, might call that "intelligent." I, without a doubt, observe that as an overture of man, something that must be stepped over. It is, by all means, a deficient life form that does what? Eats, sleeps, and brings nothing - it merely sustains old values, filthy laws, and countless cries for this and that. This is the case of an individual. If we are to observe the whole that such specimens form, we behold a phalanx of...meaningless existence. This phalanx, this tragedy, it sustains all the hatred, all the lies, all the "ideals" and "idols" that you and I both have argued for or against in some given moments. And what is the umbrella that sustains and with awe-inspiring devotion sustains this weak caricature? Government. Who is the most valueless, the most wicked, unclean, worthless by all means; who is the most lazy, intolerant, "patriotic," "I"-less -- these are the worms that thrive under the umbrella, this phalanx that we look up to when we should be looking down, laughing, and stepping over, and over...

    ...gone is the age where men and women are weak and unintellectual. Gone is the age where one's power must be wielded over another. And whose power? The collective power of the filthy, the worms, comes marching to us in the form of Government, sustained by the webs of little spiders and tarantulas, so poisonous, such a killer it is.

    ...sure, the "age" I speak of is "gone," but power and suffering must inflicted just one more time to wipe the slate clean from all the webs and the worms...those dirty mobs that siphon from life like leeches, standing with their "Holy Books," opinion-driven values, "wrongs" and "rights" that are sustained on everyone and everything, therefore, on all of life.

    ...gone are the days when a "moral" is moral. We are moving, hasitly, we are changing, we are unstable. What is this filthy "moral" value that they try so hard, pretend, to "sustain?"

    ...and it is quite comical, the whole thing, actually. We look at them crying for "peace" and "happiness." "Awwww," we say to ourselves, "how angelic of them; all they want is peace and happiness, and justice." How divine! But let us just be irrational for mere seconds and observe this from a different angle: where the child grows, dwelling in the opinion-driven aroma of the weak and the lazy, where all "answers" are presented in an inventory (anything outside of the inventory is "wrong" because of morals, values, and laws), we begin to perceive a sample of a specimen as we perceive today: when confronted with questions, they recall of a "Holy Book," or some dead hero, some "philosopher" who said "this" and "that;" by all means, we can examine the individual and see that he lacks individuality. And after all such harassment to the child's free flying spirit, what is one to expect? That the child becomes weary and exhausted, extremely conscious to pains (the world quickly teaches pain, differences, and hatred), and what does he do at that point? He cowers once again to this beautiful "beliefs," to the "values" he was taught, the "morals," the "rules," the "laws," completely unaware that these very things are the reason behind his weariness and exhaustion, for they drain the spirit from its flight, chain it to the ground, and leave it unlovely, desperate, and sickened. Notice the irony: he cowers to his very assassin, to his killer...and he calls this "obedience of law," "justice," and all of it, it sustains an image of a certain kind of "freedom" and "liberty."
    I thought it was easy to understand. In order for one to be anti-government, or "anarchist," there must, first, exist a government. I do not see where government exists. I see pathetic "politicians" trying to either satisfy themselves or trying to meet what the idiotic majority desires. I do not call this "government." Where are the governments? Nowhere. How can there be "anarchists?" It is like trying to create an opposite of something that does not exist. I should say, however, that I am not against the concept of political principles. Simply put, though, there has not exist any "political principles" yet. What has existed is a bunch of liars, cheaters, bribers, and extremely unclean characters...all trying to move the brainless-majority.
    A shift from an opinion-oriented, uneducated, lazy, following, "I"-less pigs into the ruler-ship of the flying, the wide, the striving, those full of faith most of all to themselves. The first, step, is cleansing the world from filth. You want criticism? How harsh are you willing to perceive me? I'll assume you can tolerate, and therefore: for the step of all priorities - the anti-teaching of any kind of faith, even "spirituality," even "God." Let the children be themselves: free-spirits and young philosophers. Second: the destruction of all "culture." Those willing to drop their "cultural values" are admitted to the new world, the unwilling, they shall be dismissed gently, and if resistance is met, would be eradicated with immoral and satisfying harshness. And this will be a grand celebration. Third: the extermination of all "grand" symbols: all flags, religious symbols, churches, completely everything and anything that has a "symbolic" or a "metaphorical" value that is derived from social, cultural, or political differences -- all of those are destroyed. At any step resistance is met, no consideration is given, only a bullet. Fourth, to all those who do not love themselves fully, those who do not appreciate themselves extremely: they are disgotten immediately and without a slight of doubt or question. This shall be celebrated the most. The value of the boarders that separate the earth into small little sewers called "countries," they are with a blink of an eye erased. All atlases are burned in favor of new ones. A choice is made upon a single language: most likely a fusion of English-Spanish-French, and this shall be the new teaching. Communication shall be universalized, just like the people. And to all those that say "but culture makes the individual, that language makes the individual, that we would be all the same without those," they are all wrong. They are the "I"-less ones who, as said, are eradicated with joy and pleasure. The individual is so unique, more unique than the so-called "individual" that is the Western or Eastern man. The rest are just clones, chains of past mistakes and errors...

    With all sincerity, I have not thought of the political structure for the new world, but let us consider: it is not really "political" by the sense we understand it today. No more is a "politician" a liar, for no longer does he have to side with someone or something on little issues. The new disagreements will be the major disagreements, the real worries that the world would worry about, not today's little infantile "issues."

    I do not know what to do with the teaching of "history." Should it be taught? Or should it be exterminated? An issue I am still being troubled by...

    I realize that this is stepping over many, many people's lives. One must realize that before one knows joy, he must know pain. And therefore, before the ultimate joy, comes the ultimate of all pains. There must be a heart strong enough, immoral enough to step over all those lives without a single "but," and enjoy it as well, for that is what it is: the coming of ultimate joy...

    It must be made sure, that no culture-lover, no error-embracer, no clown and jester, not a single mentally lazy one, would survive to see the new world, for a single blemish as such can so easily and in no time infect, inject its poison. Such a disease must be, at all costs, made extinct.
  10. Tabasco DDR Fanatic

    The Bible is prophetic...not him himself writing it........therfore I didn't say that they weren't God's words, just him not writing the Bible himself
  11. Aku Necromancer Headlights off

    It, however,...sounded like you were questioning it

  12. DÛke Memento Mori

    ...
    And so what if he were questioning it? Is that "sinful?" Is that "doubtful?" Is that filthy? Is that fearful? Is that inhuman? I suppose we should all just take an infinite moment of silence, never question such a "Holy Book," simply because. And you tell me that faith does not require stupidity and blindness! You have shown that it does over and over again.

    All - all - "faithful" characters have shown it. It is impossible to avoid showing it, because it is the subterranean, secret truth that sustains all faiths - to be stupid. It is the essence of all believers, to be divine liers, deceiving saints...

    Here is a mirror. Look at yourself again…
    What a headache!
  13. Gizmo Composite: 1860

    Please learn to write in comprehensible English, Duke. This isnt about us all being too stupid to understand the questions you dare to ask... its about your use of the English language being awful.
  14. DÛke Memento Mori

    ...
    From all these people, you are the only one who reads without understanding. Why do you blame it on my writing? Aku seems to be just fine with it. Ericbess, reads, replies, argues...without any notable debate over the writing style. Have you considered that the problem may be the other way around?

    I am so easily read, in fact, that I was banned from other sites merely because of the content, not the style...
  15. DÛke Memento Mori

    ...
    First, I would like you to show me an example of this "comfort" you are talking about? Where must one look only to see those whom are comfortable with what they "know?" Do we look at the current war, or the past wars; should we recite history of tragedies, or what? Not many are comfortable with life. I am by all mean comfortable - I am simply uncomfrotable with the stench that plagues it...the ones whom are uncomfortable with it, like the "faithful." They lag, hesitate, and pro'ject their uncomfortable-selves, their depressive ugliness on the rest, the few, the rare...the flying...

    And...

    ...let us step a step farther and say this: what is wrong with feeling comfortable with this life? What is wrong with the senses? Should one distrust this comfort in favor of another, better, immortal comfort? How...selfish. Or is this comfort lacking something? To the "faithful," indeed it does: it lacks the spirit of murderous revenge against life - there is not a single reason why one should be uncomfortable with life as it is (this excludes the social, cultural, and political opinions), because life, generally, is beautiful and should be enjoyed - to suggest that its comfort is not as good as the gratification one receives because he is faithful is, without a doubt in my heart, the most popular and the deepest of all lies. Is it not so obviously merely an infatuation with something better than yourself, because you dislike yourself, or are unsatisfied, fearful, doubting? Yes - the very doubt in yourself, you take that and make it undoubt in something you deem as more perfect than yourself; does all this not justify why each man's God is different than anothers'? Each man is different, and therefore, his "perfect undoubt" is different - his "God" is different, his faith is different. It is merely a cancer, by thus, again like a filthy "opinion" and nothing more. All is nothing more than a projection of a perfect-self, more perfect than the current-self. This is dispassionate, unspirited, and lacking...for it disparages the self...

    ...if there is any God that favors such a betrayal to life, such a slander, than by all means, one mustn't call this a God, but it seems to be the Devil whom you kneel down before.

    ...and still, as long as you are kneeling down, you are no one. The devil wants you not, neither does God...

    ...and if they do want such a pitiful, helpless, self-victimized specimens, than these "gods" are not as perfect as one protrays them to be,...

    ...and therefore, they are merely another type of man.

    ...and we look at all that and say: you are infatuated with humanity on a deceptive level, and so, you are are a lesser being...
    And they are still being decieved still. By who? Themselves.
  16. Aku Necromancer Headlights off

    By all means he can believe what ever he wants to believe, however I think I should point out what is Biblical and what isnt.
  17. Aku Necromancer Headlights off

    ...many avoid God, they are not comfortable with the him because they do not understand him. We are all given brains, but we were also given them that we might apply reason in finding God. Sadly, to many try to reason him out with logic.

    As Christians, we are forbidden to judge, we are to live our lives to the fullest, strengthen our relationship with God, and better our relationships with other people. I agree with you that life is beautiful, have I suggested otherwise? I disagree with you that I am selfish, that I want revenge on life. However every Christians God is not different, and if so, tell me how.

    Really? One is either on Gods side or by default, Satans side. I think by my strong belief in Jesus, his teachings, and accepting his death and resurrection as the means for eternal life as a good sign Im on Gods side.

    You are talking about the devil and God that you dont believe in right?

    Greater is he that is in me than he who is in you. John 4.4

    If you are right, we all win...
  18. DÛke Memento Mori

    ...

    The mere fact that you recite Biblical "facts" as a sign of truth, is a sign of a kind of lacking. Do you see me revolting against myself by recalling of another He or another She, or someone beside me? Thus far, and this can be seen through the entire thread, you have said nothing. Observe: when one looks at you, he sees no individual. What he sees is a reflection of flying opinions, the profitable and beautiful opinions, to be more specific. One looks, hard, trying to find something in there...but all lacks and all wants and longs...there is nothing. Where are you?

    ...A person who cannot make his case, because he has not a case, simply because he looks back and picks up whatever thing some dead animal had uttered before it blissfully and thankfully departs...

    ...A person who cannot make his case, has no case, because he finds his cases somewhere during midnight, standing all alone in a subway - that's where he picks up his cases - while instead, that lonely little wait of his should have brought him into thinking. And what is thinking? It is questioning, doubting, arguing...it is the very ability to judge.

    ...And now you bring to light that you "cannot judge." And you tell me that religion does not make lazy? What is more comfortable than living blindly - yes, living blindly - than not to argue with the wrong, not look at, but simply look not. Did you not tell me that faith does not make blind? Did you not tell me that faith does not make stupid? Behold! then!

    ...and for you to tell me that I should not utter the word "God" or "Devil" simply because I "do not believe," what a daring aspect! What a desperate logic you are trying to weave on me with what little webs you have left! It is the logic of a retarded child, of a one who has lost the argument, and now is simply uttering like a child.

    ...you see, you try to be logical, but you fail, and thus, you become disgustingly illogical, nonsensical, and utterly, utterly, utterly meaningless when viewed from a perspective that embraces all of humanity, from beginning to end. To life and the universe, you are a plane character, not multi-dimensional. Why? Because your point views, your happy "opinions," have done what thus far? They have decided to take a rest for a long, long time - forever maybe - and where do these worms reside? Right here, in this time, in this era. Your beliefs do not transcend the moment - they simply rest in the this and now. We look at your beliefs and whisper with suspicious concern to ourselves: "does he realize that his beliefs do not transcend neither forward nor backward? They do not relate to men and women of ages. So what are they? They are a drug that comforts a sad, sad, sad soul, a running spirit, one that dares not look in the mirror - not at all - for it would see its vampiric teeth, its long, unclean, sharp claws. And what is the use of the mirror, then? Would such a vampire even see his reflection? He does not exist! He does not exist," we scream to our spirits, “He does not exist!”

    And woe to all those that do not exist...

    ...but all this you call "faith."

    ...and all this, you say, is righteous...

    I ask "Why?"

    ...would I expect an answer from you to this silly why of mine? No. You would, once again, bombard me with Biblical words. One must realize that if I wanted to talk to the Bible, I would. But silly ol’me decided to talk to people – and right and then and there I was stopped at my tracks before moving any further: the stop sign said – “Warning: No People Here, Just Reflections of Voiceless Words.”

    How insincere is it all.

    And I will say it once again, without shame: those who are faithful, those who embrace culture, those who have no "I" of themselves but merely recite echoes and perplexes, those who worship not themselves but worship idols in the name or "getting closer to" -- all those must, at once, be eradicated.

    What have you brought to the conversation?

    ...nothing but your Bible. You claim to be "getting closer to God," when more sincerely, you seem to be "running away from yourself" in hope that a god would give you yourself back again...
  19. Aku Necromancer Headlights off

    I don’t need to make a case, God has told us to share the truth with whomever we can, then its between them and God. It is now between you and God. My work here is done. You have read what I have had to say, and I am certain none of it has touched your soul. Perhaps one day it will have a meaning. I guess the only thing left for me is eternal life, love, joy and peace in heaven.

    Peace,
    Aku
  20. DÛke Memento Mori

    It is nice to finally hear this. Without "eternal life, love, joy, and peace in heaven," you would not be faithful at all, would you now? Like a clown doing what he does for money, not out of love...

    Believe it or not, Aku, I was closer to faith before...but having these conversations -- not just with you, but with all those who claim to be faithful -- I have, since then, moved farther and farther away from faith. It is not because of you or your kind -- it is because what I have envisioned of faith becomes more true with every word the "faithful" utters...

    ...I was hoping to be wrong. Believe it or not -- I keep my heart open all the time; whenever one wants to talk about any subject, I am more than willing; and as you may know, I have no real definite "beliefs," I am as much of a mystery to myself as to anyone else; maybe I am still looking for something of value -- that does not mean I will accept anything...just that I am, at least, willing...

    ...and in all honesty, to be searching has been so much more fun than to be content and sitting.
    ~The End~

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