Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Spiderman, Feb 8, 2007.
Haven't seen last night's yet...
I guess no real surprise that Lisi went, although it seemed the guys might have flip-flopped right before the vote since she said she wanted to stay. But I think that any chance of that went out the window when she talked during the pre-vote with Jeff and all.
How about Yao Man in the challenge? I loved Mookie's expressions when Yao Man kept getting the best shots for Moto (well, we don't know how Earl would have done, but still...). He's becoming my wife's favorite.
Not much else... most of the focus was on Ravu, so not really getting a feel for Moto other than they want Stacey out because of concerns that she'll flip to Ravu when the tribes merge.
I think they might have been planning to backdoor streets. They were talking about him flipping instead of bringing cassandra on board that day. Remember the one guy saying he was going to step it up in this compitition and that he had archery skills, if you watch just before he shoots he looks over and gets a nod from his buddy and then misses the whole target. I think they threw the match. When they get back lisi starts right off the bat that there is nothing left for her in the game and wants to go home, I think that's what clinched it. She didn't care in the reward challange and cost if for them being out of step and they didn't say boo, I think it was her saying she wanted out even if she changed her mind last second made all the difference in who went. The challange just seemed shady to me so I think streets was the target.
Really? I totally missed all of that... I just thought it was funny that the guy who said he could do archery missed it after all of his talk...
Maybe. I got the impression that the bow wasn't the type that Edgardo was used to. He appeared to be having a decent amount of trouble getting the arrow to stay where he wanted it. I suppose it's possible that it was intentional, but I didn't get that impression.
As for Lisi - Even if you were wanting to vote Dreams off at that point, you're banking your 5-5 tie on a person who's flip-flopped back and forth on a regular basis over the course of about a week now. I think I would rather risk what Dreams might do on the merge than what you can be fairly certain Lisi will do.
And for someone who is all talk about what a bunch of losers she was surrounded by, I couldn't believe it when she said that they shouldn't be wasting effort trying to win reward challenges. How does she think you have the energy to do better in the immunity challenge? Besides, learning the dance is going to take away from which preparations for the immunity challenge?
I also thought it was pretty telling that after Lisi told them all the clues, they went and dug up the idol without her. Mookie nearly blew it though.
It's too bad that Yau-Man wasn't on that tribe, though. Lisi would have dug up the fake idol and tried to use it...Still hoping that happens, but it's not likely.
I thought it was pretty dumb of her to tell them about the immunity idol in the first place. And yeah, when they searched for it without her (and Dreamz) and found it and didn't tell her? That pretty much said where she stood in the tribe with them.
And yeah, Mookie was dumb to try to hide the evidence of the digging, or at least making a lot of noise while doing it.
I don't think she would have dug up the idol though, she seemed pretty lazy.
Ugh, no interview today at TV Insider... and I was looking forward to what Lisi had to say...
Saw the episode...
Man, Mookie is dumb for telling Dreamz about the idol. Yeah, maybe he felt he needed to show trust, but c'mon, if Mookie is really going to use the idol for himself as he keeps indicating in his private interviews, Dreamz doesn't need to know.
The splitting up the merged tribe into two "teams" is how they should be doing it from the beginning (I think I said that before). And man, Michelle lost it for her team when she couldn't get the first bag. Yao Man just keeps on being amazing
I really thought Stacy would be out since Mookie and Dreamz knows what she means to Eduardo and Alex so it certainly was surprising that Michelle was voted out. But not THAT surprising, as I can see from Dreamz point of view that he probably was sending a message to Alex that he's on board with him still. But I don't know how it'll play out, unless they keep dividing into two teams for the immunity challenges for a while.
I'm not sure I agree. For a one-time twist, it was okay, but there is a huge problem with it.
As soon as the tribes were split, there were really only two people potentially on the chopping block: Michelle and Edgardo. Who made the mistake, Dreams or Mookie? Obviously, telling Dreams about the idol was dumb, but when it came time to eliminate someone, there is a problem. If you eliminate Stacy, you instantly scream to Alex that he's not in charge. Suddenly, he knows you aren't behind him and the starts exploring other options.
Best case scenario if you eliminate Stacy is that the entire alliance falls apart and you hand the game over to the other alliance. To be honest, when the alliances are in this much disarray, that often happens anyway. There is a good chance that Mookie was right. If you are going to start making demands on the alliance, best to establish pecking order early. Still, I'm not sure and I think that from their perspective, voting off Michelle certainly seemed the safe way to go.
But I digress. I'm actually a bit disappointed with Earl and YauMan this episode. And this goes to the reason I don't think splitting up the mearned tribes is a great idea. If they wanted to win the challenge, then they did awesome. However, if they wanted to win the game, they should have thrown the challenge and eliminated Edgardo instead of winning the challenge and sending Michelle to her demise.
I mean honestly, who did they think was going to be eliminated instead? They didn't protect their alliance and now they are in trouble. Their best hope right now is that the other alliance crumbles, which does seem like a strong possibility.
The largest problem with the situation that Alex, Mookie, Edgardo, and Dreams have is that if people in the alliance truely understand the order of elimination, there is a huge chance for a change. But it has a better chance of success if you've already disassembled the opposing alliance.
Get rid of Michelle, Earl, and Yao Man first and then Cassandra and Boo are going to be more than happy to join with Mookie and Dreams in taking down Alex, Edgardo, and Stacy...
I certainly don't want it to go that way, but in the end I think Dreams was smarter than Mookie...
I can't remember who was on the winning team, but from what they were saying, Boo seemed to be the one on the chopping block as he was the first choice for both alliances. That's why he was helping the puzzle people at the end and why he was so relieved that they won. I don't think Eduardo would have been voted off.
Yeah, if Dreamz had voted for Stacey, that would have sent a message to Alex, but really, what kind of options could he have explored? Stacey was the swing vote for his alliance. If she was voted off, and Dreamz stayed with the other alliance (or at least with Cassandra, who was with the other alliance), Alex really couldn't have done anything with Eduardo and Mookie (although Mookie already sent a message at that point by voting for Stacey).
This kind of thing would work better from the beginning I think, when people aren't so established in their tribes and alliances. They'd have to constantly shift and make and break alliances. When it happens now, it's interesting, but yeah, alliances are pretty much set from past experiences and tribes.
If Earl and YauMan have any suspicion of who the other alliance is, it would have been a good opportunity to weaken it by booting off Edgardo. Since they didn't even think to throw the challenge, you are probably right that Boo would have gone anyway. However, if they had the foresight to throw the challenge, they might have already considered who the other alliance is also. Still, the fact that they couldn't confer before counsil...it probably would have been Boo, just to be safe.
Neither Dreamz nor Mookie want Stacy as the swing vote. Alex just told them and neither want her because it puts them on the outside. I think they want Cassandra as the swing vote and Dreamz is convinced she would vote however he tells her.
Like I said, I think Dreamz's position of voting Michelle was better thought out than Mookie's voting for Stacey, but I think it's about waiting for a better time to strike. Use the alliance you have for now, knowing when they are planning to cut you so you can switch things up before that happens.
I think they do know the core members of the other alliance, just not Mookie and Dreamz positions. But they do know Alex and Eduardo is against them. But they're afraid that Boo would go over to them, which is why they want to get rid of him. And same with A & E wanting to get rid of Boo, that he'd stay with new Moto.
You could be right about Dreamz decision. We'll have to see how the future immunity challenges are held.
Okay, if you haven't seen the episode yet, I'm planning on commenting on tribal counsel, so you may want to watch before you go through my entire post. I won't talk about who was voted out yet, but there is enough to read between the lines of what happens, so if you haven't seen it and don't want to know which "alliance" comes out on top, go watch it first...
A lot of stuff going on this week. Definitely a few people standing out this week, but I guess that always happens when they have the revealing trivia competition. What do your tribemates really think about you.
I feel bad for Stacy. You think anyone likes her? Alex - maybe you better re-evaluate who's listening to you and who isn't. They think your arrogant and they think you feel like you are in control...but aren't...He probably heard the "in control of the game" part and was flattered. Got to read between the lines, Alex... Tribal council will teach you that if nothing else does.
People to watch - Cassandra. That girl reads people like a book. Not only does she know who's who, but she knows who's thinking who's who. Didn't miss a single questions.
Yau-Man - They already say that they are surprised by his physical ability. I'm not sure I would have made that comment after the immunity challenge about going another hour. That might have been pushing graciousness. And I don't think that everyone appreciated his gesture with sharing the idol for "luck for everyone".
But the expressions on the faces of the three horsemen (I would have liked to have seen Dreamz's expression too, though) and even on Rocky's face during tribal council were precious. They really thought they had everything figured out.
So now what? Immunity idol back up for grabs? There's a twist. Do you arrange to send your own people to exile just to try to have both of them? If I were Earl, I'd be volunteering to go at this point. Actually, I think anyone might right now.
Finally saw it last night.
Wow, lots of scheming going on, but we know who lost that one. I just wonder if not sharing the final vote info to Dreamz is gonna bit Earl & Co or not... he may go back to the "Horseman", but they don't trust him either. And Stacey switching sides was kinda surprising...
Cassandra is definitely the underdog to be watched
About the preview: What's up with going through people's stuff? Although Yao-Man should have hid the idol separately away from his stuff...
Did you see last night yet? I think the going through stuff backfired on Alex and Mookie. They were trying to use it to get people against Yao-Man, but in the end, everyone (even Jeff) just got upset with them for going through stuff in the first place.
So here's what I want to know...Is there anything in the rules that would have prevented them from just taking Yao-Man's idol and using it themselves? If they don't tell anyone which is going to use it, it's a 50/50 chance of thwarting (well...under normal circumstances - wouldn't have worked yesterday). Worse-case scenario is that Yao-Man doesn't have it anymore.
Still, there is already stirrings against the idol, so they may have done some damage after all. I think next week is going to be pretty telling. Jeff's right that Alex could be in a position of power for the next tribal council. A lot depends on how much the pecking order has been made clear. Fortunately, Earl understands why that is dangerous information and refused to talk to Alex about it.
I think Dreamz is the most dangerous person right now. He's trying to play all sides and can't be trusted. I don't see him winning, but he could cause some upset, particularly with Alex and Mookie trying to plant seeds of disharmony already.
I agree about Cassandra. Right now, I think the strongest "Alliance" is Earl, Yao-Man, and Cassandra, but if anyone tries to attack the alliance, Earl and Yao-Man are the ones they would target. That sets Cassandra up in a very good position.
Yeah, I saw Thursday's.
I don't know the answer to your question about whether they could just "take" the idol. I mean, we all assume not, but who knows what would happen if they took it and tried to play it at tribal? Obviously a big fight would break out over stealing and whatnot, but I don't know if it's actually "illegal".
I agree about the stunt backfiring, but yeah, I think they did plant some seeds of doubt/distrust when there weren't before.
Alex definitely is dangerous because really, it's Earl, Yao-Man, and Cassandra against Dreamz, Boo, and Stacey so he could be a swing vote if they don't stick together next time (and Alex doesn't win immunity). It definitely depends if they start figuring out the pecking order and the people on the bottom want to move up.
Although it was funny that Alex put down Mookie's name to save himself instead of letting it go to a tie
A lot is about perception, though. I agree that it's Earl, Yao-Man, and Cassandra and the other three are sort of on the outside, but I'm not sure they see it that way.
For example, if Stacy sees it as Earl, Yao-Man, Cassandra, and Stacy against Boo and Dreamz, then she may not be worried yet about what happens after that.
Based on the previews, I think Alex's comments about the idol are going to eventually put Yao-Man in a bad position. Which is kind of sad because he only did what everyone else would have done had they found the idol instead. The only thing about that that makes him a threat is that he actually did find it. I think Dreamz is the one that will eventually try to turn on him though and I don't think Dreamz really has much credibility with anyone right now. The trick is to use him as long as you can and then get rid of him before he turns on you.
Sort of like Johnathan from the previous season.
Well, he just has to use the idol, which may not be the best timetable for him but that's what it's there for And he'll live for another stretch on the island...
Unless he wins individual immunity again.
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