Christopher Columbus

[Almindhra]

I cannot believe what I'm reading...I cannot believe this...Possibly, if you, Duke, were a woman, you would consider rape something more than just, I don't know, however you're claiming it not to be something devestating in a woman's life...I hope this isn't one of your sick, S&M sh*t, that women want to be raped or something (yes, I have heard that out of someone's mouth before)...Rape is something that leaves physical and emotional scares...And did you ever think, that for married or dating women, some husbands will leave them because now their wife is "dirty" and has been "used" by some other man...And how about when a woman becomes pregnant from rape?...Either an abortion, which should not be the answer, or having the baby is an option...Now lets just say she doesn't put it up for adoption, do you know how hard it would be to look at that baby, and try to feel love for it, while you're looking at a part of your rapist's flesh and blood?...Sexual crimes, really against anyone, are terrible, and I truly feel sorry for it's victims...

You really underestimate the effects of rape, Duke...I hope now everyone truly sees what an idiot this kid is...

 

[Apollo]

DUke, you're surprising the heck out of me. What if, when we were having the whole "bomb/don't bomb Afghanistan" debate, I had said:

These things happen, and they happen to someone. Waaaa haaaaa.

I'm quite sure you'd have gone off on me. Don't be surprised when people (especially the lady of the CPA) goes off on you.

 

[DÛke]

Apollo:

I'm quite sure you'd have gone off on me. Don't be surprised when people (especially the lady of the CPA) goes off on you.

I probably would have. Why? Because I think it's more important. However, I wouldn't be surprised if anyone would go "off" on me...like Almindhra. To tell you the truth, I was waiting for Almindhra to get her little miserable self and insult me somehow. The girl seems to live so she can hide her insecurities by insulting others. See, Apollo, if I had gone off on you, you'd be so surprised, and claim that I'm uneducated or an idiot. I, on the other hand, would consider it to be solely your opinion...and would not be "shocked" at all...see, I accept people's opinions, not reject them because they don't parallel with my little ideals.

Almindhra:

I cannot believe what I'm reading...I cannot believe this...Possibly, if you, Duke, were a woman, you would consider rape something more than just, I don't know, however you're claiming it not to be something devestating in a woman's life...I hope this isn't one of your sick, S&M sh*t, that women want to be raped or something (yes, I have heard that out of someone's mouth before)...Rape is something that leaves physical and emotional scares...And did you ever think, that for married or dating women, some husbands will leave them because now their wife is "dirty" and has been "used" by some other man...And how about when a woman becomes pregnant from rape?...Either an abortion, which should not be the answer, or having the baby is an option...Now lets just say she doesn't put it up for adoption, do you know how hard it would be to look at that baby, and try to feel love for it, while you're looking at a part of your rapist's flesh and blood?...Sexual crimes, really against anyone, are terrible, and I truly feel sorry for it's victims...

Meaningless ranting. Did I say it was right to rape? No. I simply said that it's *not* the biggest issue in the world. If you disagree, at least make your opinion intelligent enough by not insulting an opinion. If a man truely loved a woman, he wouldn't leave her because she got rapped, but he'd stick with her all the way -- just shows what you know about love and relationships. Considering a wife to be "dirty" because she got rapped is something very, very, very stupid only idiots would even think of . I guess, however, this justifies your true colors Almindhra...

As for:

You really underestimate the effects of rape, Duke...I hope now everyone truly sees what an idiot this kid is...

I hope everyone sees how truely lifeless you are now, Almindhra. You're the most insecure, miserable, most judgemental and egotistical idiot I've ever seen alive.

This is so stupid, you know that? I got people on my back because I don't think rape is the biggest issue in the world? What kind of a child's play is this? Frankly, I think there are other important issues in life -- that makes me a bad guy? <laughs>

 

[Svenmonkey]

Now, now. No need to call names...

 

[Rando]

You've twisted the issue around so much now DUke, that I don't even think you realize what this side topic is all about. There is just no reasoning with you.

Don't bother to resopnd to my post, because I have every intention of just ignoring whatever immature, unreasoned, senseless and instigating popey-cock you type. I'm through with it. No one has a chance to have any real, meaningful conversation with you.

 

[Spiderman]

TICM: That made a whole lot of sense. Unfortunately, we like to carry it further....

Ransac: That's true, but apparently CC is the controversial one

DUke: Now who's to say rape isn't the "biggest" issue in the world? That seems to be matter of opinion... certainly it's a big matter when in the aforementioned Bosnian war, one side used it because they knew that the women would kill themselves because of the stigma or prohibitions attached to it. It was just another part of ethnic cleansing; they could just kill the men, but why not have some fun and rape the women who they know will kill themselves? That way they wouldn't have do it themselves...

Yeah, rape and murder happen. It doesn't mean you have to LET it happen. Hopefully one of these days mankind will evolve so it doesn't happen.

And anytime someone forces themselves on another person without their consent, be it rape or murder or what have you, is wrong. I can't see how there's any debating that point; I think we already did that in another thread. When you affect another person against their will, that's a problem. Making it physical just makes it a "step" up.

 

[DÛke]

...

Spiderman, you contradicted yourself here.

Spiderman:

Now who's to say rape isn't the "biggest" issue in the world?

Versus...

Spiderman:

That seems to be matter of opinion...

So it *is* a matter of opinion, isn't it? So as to your question, who is to say rape isn't the biggest issue? Me. It's the matter of my opinion. It is my opinion, and solely my opinion that rape is not the biggest issue. To be honest, I really don't care about that particular issue all that much anyway...so why do I have Apollo, Rando, and Almindhra all on my back saying things that I have not really said?

Rape is wrong -- yes.

Rape is bad -- yes.

Those are general points that everyone mostly agrees about.

1. Does DÛke think rape is wrong -- yes.

2. Does DÛke think rape is bad -- yes.

3. Does DÛke think it's a big issue -- no.

4. Does DÛke care for rape all that much -- heck no.

Now, in numbers 3 and 4, replace "DÛke" with any person you know...and you may get different answer depending on that person. The answer may or may not parallel with your ideas...but that is the whole thing about opinions: they don't have to parallel.

Now...

On a scale of 1 to 5 (1 being lowest, and 5 being highest), answer the following questions.

1. How wrong do you consider rape? DÛke: 5.
2. How bad to you consider rape? DÛke: 4.
3. How big is the rape issue, in your opinion? DÛke: 2.
4. Do you care about the rape issue? DÛke: 2.

See, as we get more detailed into what a person thinks about an issue, more differences will become more obvious. Basically, for example, Spiderman, you'd answer most if not all of the questions with 5s and 4s...it just means you know more about the issue, and/or it has effected your life somehow. It also means that I may have other things to worry about...maybe I have other issues that I consider to be big...maybe something other than rape has effected my life, to the point that I see rape as not being that big of a deal...

Believe it or not, we are *all* walking the same lines...as long as I agree that rape is wrong and it is bad. Other than that, it's just a matter of opinion, and the degree of that opinion -- you all should know that opinions differ. It's natural.

The end...

 

[Spiderman]

I'm not sure why you said I'm contradicting myself... all I was saying was that it's matter of opinion of whether rape is the "biggest" (or among the biggest) issues in the world (or going on).

What you said pretty much mirrors what TICM said and I have no problem with it. Just as you know that despite what you may think is not a big issue actually is and vice versa (and that goes for me too; I'm speaking "generally" (or as if I was an observer from outer space or something))

Although this all really doesn't address your initial statements that most women get over it, one way or another. THAT was pretty ignorant.

 

[DÛke]

...somewhat contradicting yourself because you say that basically there isn't one big enough to say that rape is not a big issue, yet you say that it's all a matter of opinion -- doesn't that mean everyone can say it, because it would be their opinion?

"Woman get over it somehow," well, don't they? Sure, it leaves scares...sure it's terrible...sure it's bad...sure it's wrong...sure...sure...sure...don't they get over it? Do they all commit suicide? Do they all end up with severe mental issues? Show me the statistics of how many woman "got over it," and how many just basically "died" in the sense that they're life ended be it because they're greatly scared or have gained some severe mental problem -- give me a ratio...and then we'll see...

Until then, any woman who got rapped and moved on, IN MY OPINION, has gotten over it. To what degree has she gotten over it? That depends on the woman her self...again...that's a matter of opinion...on a scale of 1-5 or 1-500...but it will be on a scale...and they all will not match...

 

[Spiderman]

I'm still confused... you say rape is not a big issue. I'm saying that's a matter of opinion; that I or anyone else can say it is. SO is that what you just said?

You tell me what your definition of "getting over it" is. Like I said above, a woman may move on with her life, but that's NOT the same as "getting over it".

To me, getting over it means they're the same person they were before the rape, in attitude, manners, hopes and dreams and fears, etc. I will guarantee you that the number of women like that after a rape is SO low that it it doesn't need backing up - it's just common sense.

If that's what "getting over it" means to you, I think you ought to provide the statistics as you stated it first, being the first to go against popular opinion. If what you mean instead is "moving on", then I can accept that.

 

[DÛke]

...if it's a matter of opinion, than I need to back up *nothing." My opinion is clear: rape is not that a big of a deal. Your opinion may differ, but I'm not questioning your opinion...

By getting over it, I somewhat mean they move on...but I mean that they move on a more extream basis that you do. Sure, scared for life or whatever...maybe more fears...but...for the most part of daily living, they have gotten over it. It's not like after the experience, they basically have lost the ability to continue living normally...

*Maybe* I don't view rape as a big deal because I never knew anyone that experienced it. Maybe it's because I lack knowledge concerning that topic...yet maybe, if I knew more, I may retain this attitude towards rape.

If anyone is thinking that I'm an "idiot" because I don't view rape as a big of a deal, than you're an idiot yourself. However, if someone is viewing me as an idiot because I claimed that women "get over it," than I could completely understand that. However, I'm not going to change my opinion...

 

[Spiderman]

It's not your opinion that "rape is not a big deal" that needs backing up, but your "opinion" that women get over it. And the way it was initially said makes it seem more of a "fact" than "opinion". Opinion usually has including with it "Probably" or "I think", meaning you are not certain.

And while we can nit-pick over what "getting over it" means to each of us, I don't think it's that confusing. To me, anything where the woman cannot live like she used to before the rape, either mentally or physically or something else, means she has not gotten over it. There may be varying degrees of how it affects her: whether she goes to one extreme and kills herself or somewhere in between where she's scared going out at night, but it all boils down to she has been affected and thus has not gotten over it. Therefore I think you're confusing "moving on" and "getting over", even to yourself.

 

[DÛke]

...

Spiderman:

There may be varying degrees of how it affects her: whether she goes to one extreme and kills herself or somewhere in between where she's scared going out at night, but it all boils down to she has been affected and thus has not gotten over it.

Yes, I agree...it does leave an effect. I didn't state that on the post that started this, but I did state it later. I agree, an effect will be left...but to be honest, I think the effect will be more on the lines of scared of going out at night, or something being that severe. I also don't think many of them attempt suicide, or lose their husbands...

If a woman does lose her husband, than at least she knows now, that he didn't really love her...

Well, I don't think I'm confusing "get over it" with "moving on," but to make it more easier for everyone to understand, or at least make it more clear of what I'm saying: yes, it does leave an effect, but not a very harsh effect. Usually, after some therapy, maybe, the woman would get over it in the sense that it does not become a complete obstacle that she had such an experience. Basically, I think most woman regain (or even a keep) a very normal life style after some time...

And in the beginning, when I said they "get over it," it was just my opinion -- if I'm saying it, than it's my opinion.

 

[Spiderman]

but to be honest, I think the effect will be more on the lines of scared of going out at night, or something being that severe. I also don't think many of them attempt suicide, or lose their husbands...

I can't answer that, as that's something only someone who's in the field would know about (which perhaps Rando is?). I read that you're implying that's what happens to the majority of women which I will offer my disagreement, as it seems to me that it's a pretty major traumatic experience, so I don't think for the majority it's going to settle down to just being scared at night. But again, only someone who has studied or experienced it can answer more definitively.

Usually, after some therapy, maybe, the woman would get over it in the sense that it does not become a complete obstacle that she had such an experience. Basically, I think most woman regain (or even a keep) a very normal life style after some time...

That's what I call more moving on. They're affected but are managing to deal with it.

 

[arhar]

Yet another pearls of wisdom from my best buddy Duke.

Apparently, rape is a lot less important than murder, and most women get over it. After all, it's just sex - hey, might as well relax and try to enjoy yourself?

You sick, ignorant piece of oink.

 

[DÛke]

...

Basically, you are left with speculations, no matter how more logical they seem. I believe, from our September 11 arugments, we disregarded any speculations. You are left with your opinion, you agree or disagree, it's your opinion, and see...I will not question it, becuase I, myself, am not sure about mine. However, I expect the same from you -- don't ask me unless *you* are *sure* about yours.

Now, we did not reach an agreement. Did we get into a foul-mouthed argument though? Did we call each other names? Did we assume the other is "uneducated" or "ignorant"? No -- so how did it end up? Not very much in agreement, but with the usual respect. You can look at it so many different ways, but if I have to say what I see...I see that you, Spiderman, are perhaps the only person I can talk to *normally,* without idiotic name-calling, like the ones coming from Almindhra (and me in return), or the way Rando argues so harshly as if he's the Doctor of all the academies.

We can disagree all day long, Spiderman, but I bet you -- you can never have me disrespect you (much).

Arhar, see what I said above. I don't respect someone who talks to me like that. I've known more people who *died* in other ways, such as smoking, car accidents, AIDS, drug abuse, murder, and war...but non of them have experienced rape. It could be *my* lack of expierence. Because I lack experience in this field, you assume so many things? Suit your fine, intelligent self...then, but don't expect me learn anything out of this, because you haven't the will to teach what you know, and even if so, you probably don't have the will to carry it in a civil manner...

If the way to inform others is by calling them "ignorant," "uneducated," "sick," and other childish names, than don't expect anyone to learn anything -- you don't pass on your knowledge with such disrespect, and those who have the knowledge but can't project it, are useless...

 

[TomB]

DÛke, you really are something...

What it is remains a mystery...

arhar, watch the language...

 

[DÛke]

TomB:

DÛke, you really are something...

What it is remains a mystery...

T.N.T for Your Brain...bud.

 

[Svenmonkey]

Well I think everyone should stop bickering and have a flan, even though it's absolutely disgusting.

 

[Gerode]

Flan tastes great when prepared right!

And DUke hasn't used "307" once this thread... *Twilight Zone music