I...hate...Eternal Witness

Discussion in 'General CPA Stuff' started by DÛke, Jan 28, 2005.

  1. Rooser Thread Necromancer

    Hmm, "easily played." I think I get it better now. Yes, Fact or Fiction certainly meets that category. Does Sakura-Tribe Elder also meet the same classification? Solemn Simulacrum? Dual Lands? Efficient Counter Spells? Just wondering.

    Hey, man, thanks for the ammo!
  2. DÛke Memento Mori

    Sakura-Tribe Elder is a good card, plain and simple. I have seen it in almost all decks that have good enough of a Green base in them. The one distinction we have to make when we look at the Elder is that its ability is never game changing. Playing the Elder will not change the how game has has developed much; the ability is great, but only as a support ability - it makes what would be a good deck a better deck. Whereas cards like Eternal Witness and Fact or Fiction are game-changing. Playing the Eternal Witness at the right time can effectively win you games, and the same with Fact or Fiction.

    Solemn Simulacrum is another great card, which would have been better off cost 5. Another design flaw. However, given all that is given, Solemn Simulacrum is not a game changing card. It's a great card, but it can't be abused easily, and although I have seen it in many decks, I just don't think it has a big of an effect to warrant questioning its power level. Nevertheless, I would have made it cost 5, certainly not 4.

    For "efficient counterspells," I am not sure what you mean. Counterspell, perhaps? Certainly, Counterspell has no place in current Standard environment, not even as a rare. And this is coming from a devout Blue player. How about Hinder? Hinder...is a very good card. Annoying to play against because it has 2 different strategic purposes, each differening than the other and requires a good deal of thought to play efficeiently. It is perhaps the most complicated counter Blue has, stragegy wise. Everyone can play 4 in their Blue decks, but not many can play them wisely. Same applies to all counters, but more so to Hinder. I have no problem with it. How about Dismiss and Rewind? Dismiss is a great card and I would really perfer it over Rewind, though Rewind is a good card too. Both aren't too big of a deal to complian about, and being counters, they both require brains to play.

    Dual lands? They're all broken. I wouldn't have printed them, I wouldn't have even suggested them.
  3. Nightstalkers Creature — Nightstalker

    Personally, I kinda like the card.

    But it's green... so I put it in the same category as things like Regrowth...
  4. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    Dude, it was like two posts... :)

    I think he was trying to get DUke to explain his views more clearly before he could discuss EW...

    The only card I can think of recently is Skullclamp, and we all know what happened to it... :)

    There's some good ones... I can think of Rancor and Blastoderm off the top of my head, but I'm sure there's lots more...
  5. Killer Joe Active Member

    Yeah DÛke, go over there and *Biatch* slap him......no wait, I owe him ;)
  6. jorael Craptacular!

    And a lot more, I know that :) The question was a reply to the unkind words Eternal Witness got. I think it's ok that there are some awesome, almost broken, commons and uncommons. Makes the game more playable.
  7. DÛke Memento Mori

    pppishhhhhhhhhhhhhh! He's mah biotch. Better cross no lines buddy.


    Now to bust some balls:
    Sorry, but what makes the game playable is the community and its standards, most of which I can relate to the imagination used to play the game. Having "almost broken commons and uncommons" has not one bit of an effect on how playable, and fun, the game is.

    Are we sure this is the Casual Players Alliance? Or...does the term "casual player" mean "secretly a bastard who wants power but can't have it so he hides behind the term 'casual.'?" Could someone clarify the situation for me...

    There is nothing wrong with having overpowered cards. But let's not confuse ourselves and pretend that they make the game playable, or fun, for that matter. The game would be just as fun, maybe even more, if all the cards were created with balance and respect to the standards of the game - it actually makes more challenging because...when all the cards are as balanced as they should be, it would really force players to spend more time on thinking and strategizing as opposed to working overtime to get those "rare" cards. But all that is ideal talk, which is really not much different than idle talk, given how the so-called “casual players” are these days.
  8. jorael Craptacular!

    Without very very good commons and uncommons, just the rares being good, more money will mean better decks (to a certain extend this is still true, but it could be much worse). Just like in other tradecard games the non-rares would not make a difference, because they are completely inferior to the expensive rares. Tournament play would be ugly. You'd need loads of cash to compete. With magic this is not the case (to a lesser extend), and that fact makes it more playable.

    As for casual play. Some players have more to spend, luckily such players can play their decks full of rares without owning the rest of a casual (multiplayer)group every single game, because budget players can affort good decks too. Cards like Sakura-Tribe Elder and Eternal Witness give everyone enough options to get along in a casual environment (and even to a certain extend in tournaments).

    I'm not asking for commons that do a gazillion damage at instant speed for 2 white mana (an example of 'overpowered') I just think it's healthy for the game that 'power' is distributed among the rares, uncommons and commons. That certainly makes magic more playable, IMO. Not everyone has hundreds of dollars (or euro's, or...) to spend on cardboard crack. :rolleyes:
  9. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    Nah, it's totally true. It could technically be worse, although I don't think very many people would want to play if it were too much worse...
  10. Killer Joe Active Member

    Kind of off the subject, but it sounds like you're refering to Eternal Witness as though it's just an uncommon like other uncommons. In my area to purchase an Eternal Witness ($8+) is just like buying a rare. So, imo, E-Witness IS a rare and certainly makes the game unbalanced in multi-player.
  11. jorael Craptacular!

    Then what do you think it would have costed if it was a rare?! Much more.
    Rancor and other awesome commons (priest of titania, counterspell) are more expensive than most uncommons and a few rares, but they would have costed a lot more if they were more rare.

    I always buy a playset of uncommons when a set comes out. You get some crap you never use, but the avage price is very good. I bought my fifth dawn uncommon playset for the cost of 4x eternal witness :D
  12. Notepad Seffy Sefro

    Jorael has an awesome point on the cost issue. I'm agreeing, that good cards should be all over the spectrum. Its nice to have awesome commons and uncommons. Though, I think there should be more bombs in the common slots, to make things really balanced on the money level.

    Call of the Herd is one such card that screams common...
  13. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    Well, the examples I gave, Rancor and Blastoderm, were going for about 50 cents to 75 cents each when I was looking for them a couple of years ago.... that's not a bad common price, considering most are considered 10 cents or throw-ins...
  14. Killer Joe Active Member

    Have you looked up Muscle Sliver lately? I think on SCG it goes for like $4. :(
  15. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    SCG has the highest card prices I've ever seen in most cases...
  16. orgg Administrator

    I've seen Muscle Sliver go for over five dollars before. SCG has Medium to High prices... but I have seen higher. It's at my local store. :(
  17. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    Well, it has high prices as far as websites go. Stores around here (if you can actually find one anymore) tend to have lower prices than websites (sometimes cardshark is lower, but that's the only one that comes to mind). I suppose in some areas that SCG has prices which are relatively by comparison to local prices...

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