Good creatures again (this time with actual list)

Discussion in 'General CPA Stuff' started by Oversoul, Oct 29, 2004.

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  1. Mikeymike Captain Hiatus

    I'm just keeping you on your toes. :p

    You passed!
  2. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    At this point, I think that the top 25 for each category would suit my purposes. I've already trimmed black a bit thanks to DÛke, but I've still got quite a bit more cutting to do. Artifacts could use some more suggestions still.

    If you have any suggestions that you think deserve to be in the top 25 of any category but are not already somewhere in the first post on this thread, could you please inform me?

    Okay, who wants to help cut green down some?
  3. mythosx Legendary Creature-Human

    Where is mountain goat on this list??? I don't need your anti goat pro-dragon agendas!
  4. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    Okay, okay, you've caught me. But you must understand how truly appealing the dragon platform is...
  5. Mikeymike Captain Hiatus

    I like the top 25 idea. For my green and artifact suggestions I will trim down the heavy qtys specifically to the high-quality guys.

    Onwards to green (and artifact)...
  6. Mikeymike Captain Hiatus

    Green: (I'd consider doing a top 40 or 50 for green, b/c it easily has the best creatures in Magic in regards to overall abilities)

    Granger Guildmage
    Multani, Maro-Sorcerer
    Nimble Mongoose
    Quirion Elves
    Phantom Centaur
    Rogue Elephant
    Seedborn Muse
    Silvos, Rogue Elemental
    Stampeding Wildebeests
    Thornscape Battlemage
    Tornado Elemental (I don't think he's top 25, but I do like him more than Thorn Elemental)
    Troll Ascetic
    Viridian Zealot
    Werebear
    Wood Elves
    Woodripper

    Artifact: (Just for the record, I'm a HUGE Mindless Automaton fan. It fits very easily into many different types of builds)

    Clockwork Dragon (underrated)
    Dodecapod
    Draco (his high CC lends itself to many alternative decktypes)
    Myr Retriever (which IMO is better than Junk Diver)
    Myr Servitor
    Steel Golem (Grid Monitor potentially as well)
    Viseling
    Triskelion

    Do you want people's individual top-25 lists?
  7. chris92 king

    is CHK included?

    red
    suq ata lancer
    kumano master yamabushi

    black
    fallen askari
    nezumi graverobber

    blue
    cephalid illusionist

    white
    longbow archer

    green
    sakura tribe elder

    artifact
    phyrexian warbeast
  8. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    Yes, COK is included...
  9. Killer Joe Active Member

    Okay Oversoul, of your compiled list, can you make a "Top 10" from each color?

    I would think that the criteria could be this:

    1.) A stand alone creature that would be good in any generic color appropiate deck (not a situational creature like Trinket Mage, because on it's own, it's weak).

    2.) Mana Cost efficient.

    3.) Multi-tasked creatures ie Masticore not only shoots creatures but regenerates, too.

    4.) Is it a "BAM!" card, you know, one that immediately changes the game dynamics as soon as it hits the table.

    5.) "Cha-Ching!", is it a $$$MONEY$$$ card.

    Here's a ~Short List~

    Artifacts
    Masticore
    Darksteel Colossus

    Black
    Hypnotic Specter
    Avatar of Woe or Whoa!

    Blue
    Morphling
    Serendib Efreet (The BLUE one)

    Gold
    Shadowmage Infiltrator
    Spiritmonger

    Green
    Ravenous Baloth
    Rofellos, Llanowar Emmissary

    Red
    Goblin Sharpshooter
    Ball Lightning

    White
    Eternal Dragon
    Exalted Angel
  10. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    I was considering top ten. I think a larger number would be more adequate for my purposes though...

    I was thinking of 50, but it seemed much too large and it gets into creatures that simply aren't as good.

    25 is the plan for now though, so why make a top ten?
  11. NorrYtt Casual Green Mage

    The first list on this thread is good. Is there a specific format for this? Are you constantly updating the first post of this thread?

    I agree with cards like Scapelexis. Scapelexis does one thing and it does it very well. He was a absolute BEAST in JU/JU/JU draft at the Prerelease against the guy that took all the Giant Warthogs and Suntail Hawks (5 of each, 40 card deck, basic Forests and Plains, one hit kill). He's a finisher and I feel that he should kill in about 6 swings.

    You got some of the obscure utility creatures on there too, like Keldon Champion, Radiant's Dragoons, and Ticking Gnomes.

    I think the deck-idea creatures can be left off this list. You don't put Endless Wurm into a green deck or even a fattie deck; you build a deck around Endless Wurm. Even so, Auratog is way better so he should cover the enchantment happy creatures. Wall of Mulch is good, but Wall of Blossoms is better at doing the same thing. I hope you understand.

    Just off the top of my head:

    There are bad guys on your list like

    WRONG

    Defiant Elf (???)
    Gamekeeper - I used him once, but there are far better things to do in green like get more mana, draw more cards, or search for fat. Natural Order is the best of these, and this creature doesn't deserve mention.
    Noble Panther - G/W has WAY better options for 3 drops it's not funny, but I like me some Fleetfoot Panther...
    Draco - This guy is just bad. I've played with him lots of times and he's far worse than just a simple Ordered Migration. Getting all the basic land in play is not easy, but just think of all the creatures you can play with WUBRG (Bringer, Spiritmonger, Ordered Migration, Sliver Queen...). Draco is a combo piece
    Myr Retriever > Junk Diver
    Thran Golem - too conditional
    Endless Wurm - conditional
    Metathran Elite - Phantom Warrior is better, but this ability isn't really relevant except for specialized Sigil of Sleep decks.
    Defender of Chaos/Order - I just don't like these guys. Instant creatures should impact the table like Simian Grunts, Caller of the Claw, or Masako the Humorless.

    MISSING

    Arc-Slogger (!) - 4th best creature in Standard after Eternal Witness, Arcbound Ravager, and Disciple of the Vault
    Shivan Hellkite - multiplayer wrecking ball, controls the table
    Two-Headed Dragon - just plain better than Shivan Dragon
    Rorix Bladewing
    Sakura-Tribe Elder
    Thrull Surgeon - utility creature with no real parallel; strong to recur against control; slightly clashes with Nezumi Shortfang in function
  12. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    First off, I haven't been giving this little project enough attention now, so it's a good thing you responded to it. Yes, the list is being updated, although not "constantly." Anyway...

    Defiant Elf: I've never heard of this creature and I assume that I got the name confused with Taunting Elf (I already removed it from the list, since I've never even heard of it).

    Gamekeeper: Green has a lot of cutting to be done. When I get around to it, I suppose that this guy won't make the top 25, but I don't know why you singled him out. He is actually quite good.

    Noble Panther: Gold is pretty close to being a list of 25, which is what I want to eventually get all of these lists down to. I will not be cutting ANYTHING from gold until the final cuts. If you think that there are some other gold creatures that are particularly better and deserve to be on the list above Panther (but aren't there) please mention them.

    Draco: Artifacts are my lowest category. Also, as you mentioned he is a combo piece. Creatures that are used for purposes other than attacking and blocking will make the list on merit of their other abilities. Draco has the highest mana cost of any card in the
    entire game and many cards rely on the size of the number in the upper right corner.

    Myr Retriever > Junk Diver: Um, that's been said already on this thread. Do you mean that Junk Diver should be cut?

    Thran Golem: A simple creature enchantment (any creature enchantment) makes him into a 5/5 flying, first-striking, trampler. He's not a bad deal. Sure, he's not Masticore either, but not everything on the list is. With how small my artifact category is, he really does stand to make the top 25. What would you like to see replace him?

    Endless Wurm: I've seen this creature work very well with Rancor on several occasions, but it occurs to me that Auratog is a lot better at that job anyway. I will probably cut Wurm soon.

    Metathran Elite: He probably won't make it past my next cut of blue.

    Defender dudes: I've never had a liking for these guys. They were suggested by someone else and I added them. They aren't horrible, but I'll probably cut them soon too.

    Arc Slogger: You've got to be kidding me. I hope I never have to see another Arc Slogger again. I have some sort of irrational hatred of this creature. Also, it's not very good.

    Disciple of the Vault: Not missing. Seriously, he was there already.

    Shivan Hellkite: He is being added presently.

    Two-Headed Dragon: Eh. I will add it, but I don't know how long it will stay up there. It isn't really better than Shivan Dragon either.

    Rorix: Well, it does have haste. Okay, added.

    Sakura something: Sorry, but I don't know what that is. My Appr. only goes up to 5th Dawn and maybe I'll update it someday, but that guy is from COK and I don't have the slightest idea what it does.

    Thrull Surgeon: I've always liked it, but it never really pays off well enough. I will add it, but again, I don't know that it will do much but just get cut when I finally go through this and separate the wheat from the chaff...

    Thanks. I'll be sure to get to cutting these lists down soon. Oh, and what is that Sakura thing anyway?
  13. Mikeymike Captain Hiatus

  14. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    Ooh, that is pretty good. I'll add it.
  15. Gizmo Composite: 1860

    Hmmm... shall I make the real list now? Anybody who dismisses Arc Slogger as 'not very good' and would include Initiates Of The Ebon Hand is obviously a bit wrong in the head.

    Back in a bit with a real list of good creatures... this might take a while.
  16. Gizmo Composite: 1860

    Red

    Ali From Cairo
    Arc Slogger
    Atog
    Avalanche Riders
    Balduvian Horde
    Ball Lightning
    Covetous Dragon
    Crater Hellion
    Dwarven Miner
    Fireslinger
    Gempalm Incinerator
    Goblin Cadets
    Goblin Lackey
    Goblin Patrol
    Goblin Piledriver
    Goblin Raider
    Goblin Sharpshooter
    Goblin Sledder
    Goblin Soothsayer
    Goblin Warchief
    Gorilla Shaman
    Grim Lavamancer
    Ironclaw Orcs
    Jackal Pup
    Kird Ape
    Kris Mage
    Lightning Dragon
    Marton Stromgald
    Mogg Fanatic
    Mogg Flunkies
    Mogg Raider
    Molten Hydra
    Orcish Artillery
    Orcish Cannoneers
    Orcish Librarian
    Orcish Lumberjack
    Orcish Settlers
    Orgg
    Rakavolver
    Rathi Dragon
    Scoria Cat
    Shard Phoenix
    Shivan Dragon
    Shivan Zombie
    Siege Gang Commander
    Skizzik
    Sparksmith
    Squee, Goblin Nabob
    Starke Of Rath
    Suq Ata Lancer
    Viashino Sandstalker
    Wildfire Emissary
  17. Gizmo Composite: 1860

    Black

    Ascendant Evincar
    Ashen Ghoul
    Avatar Of Woe
    Black Knight
    Braids, Cabal Minion
    Carnophage
    Chilling Apparition
    Coffin Queen
    Crypt Angel
    Crypt Creeper
    Crypt Rats
    Dauthi Horror
    Dauthi Slayer
    Demonic Hordes
    Derelor
    Desolation Angel
    Eastern Paladin
    Erg Raiders
    Evil Eye Of Orms-By-Gore
    Fallen Angel
    Fallen Askari
    Fledgling Djinn
    Grinning Demon
    Hate Weaver
    Hell's Caretaker
    Hidden Horror
    Hypnotic Specter
    Insidious Bookworms
    Juzam Djinn
    Knight Of Stromgald
    Krovikan Horror
    Laquatus's Champion
    Mindslicer
    Minion Of Leshrac
    Nantuko Shade
    Necratog
    Necrosavant
    Nekrataal
    Nether Shadow
    Nether Spirit
    Nightscape Familiar
    Order Of The Ebon Hand
    Phantasmal Fiend
    Phyrexian Negator
    Phyrexian Plaguelord
    Phyrexian Rager
    Phyrexian Scuta
    Plague Spitter
    Plaguebearer
    Priest Of Yawgmoth
    Ravenous Rats
    Rebel Informer
    Royal Assasin
    Sengir Vampire
    Sewer Rats
    Shadow Guildmage
    Skittering Skirge
    Sorceress Queen
    Spike Cannibal
    Stromgald Cabal
    Stronghold Taskmaster
    Thrashing Wumpus
    Thrull Surgeon
    Trench Wurm
    Will O The Wisp
  18. Gizmo Composite: 1860

    Not true at all. I have an Air Elemental - would you rather have the base 4/4 or the base 5/5? Same is true for if I'm holding two shocks, or a Prophetic Bolt, or... or... or... Shivvie's basic fatness is more important than subtelties of the abilities. When you get either in play you'e rocking hard, and Shivvie is the one most likely to stay in play, which is what's important.

    Shivan Dragon > Two-Headed Dragon
  19. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    And what is so great about Arc Slogger?
  20. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    Hey Oversoul, you can get the CHK Apprentice patch here
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