Wall Of Deceit

Discussion in 'Single Card Strategies' started by Homestar, Feb 29, 2004.

  1. Homestar Who invited this guy?

    hey all, hey i made a morph deck and i just got this card "wall of deceit" and it a morph cost but it also says seperatly above the morph description that i can tap 3 to turn him face down any time. now i also have this card called Aven Farseer and his reads that whenever a card is flipped face up, he gets +1/+1 counter on him. so what im wonderin is ifi have the aven farseer out and get that wall of deceit out then can i like turn him face down then turn him up then turn him face down blah blah so on and so forth all in one turn? cuz i think that would be an awesome combo.
  2. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    So, for what is it U3, you can flip him face down, then back up again, giving your creature (a wall) +1/+1?

    Well, it works, as far as I can tell. I don't know the exact texts of the cards right now, but I'll just assume your combo is fine, probably is anyway...

    What I'm really wondering is: why do you say...

    "I think that would be an awesome combo"?
  3. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    You can do it in one turn as long as you have the mana to pay for the turning over (3 each time) and the morph cost. You don't pay just once and then keep doing it - you have to pay each time you flip face-down or face-up.
  4. Rooser Thread Necromancer

    Forget Aven Farseer, try Aphetto Runecaster. You get to draw a card each time something is flipped over with that guy!
  5. Homestar Who invited this guy?

    o.k aven farseer is a 1/1 flyer that cost 1 plain and 1 colorless to get and every time a card is flipped up, i get to put a permenant +1/+1 counter on him. so why would i want to draw a card and deck myself since all of my friends have bigger decks then me.
  6. GauntletKing New Member

    avan farseer os OK, but you must do the runecaster combo. paying 4 to draw a card anytime those 2 cards are in play is... well I'm sure SOMEONE on this site can tell you the advantage of drawing a card versus putting a +1/+1 counter on a single creature.
  7. orgg Administrator

    Homestar(037?), the drawing of cards is a GOOD thing. It's the whole Card Advantage theory rearing its head.

    You have read the beginner's stuff at Starcitygames.com, right?

    one thing is this: why only have the Aven? Why not both of them in the deck?
  8. Istanbul Sucker MCs call me sire.

    Drawing more cards causes you to have more resources at your disposal at any given time than your friends. In other words, it doesn't matter if you get close to decking, so long as you DON'T.

    I don't see why you shouldn't use Aven Farseer AND the Aphetto guy. Make sure you put Echo Tracer in there, though - just have him use his ability to bounce himself. Admittedly not as good as Wall of Deceit, but it also makes him an immortal blocker, and another source of infinite flips if you don't happen to find your Wall. I was swinging with 7/7 and 5/5 Aven Farseers thanks to Echo Tracer...just ask Orgg. :D
  9. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    Ancestral Recall, for example is good.
  10. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    Dude, you think he has access to an Ancestral? From his posts, I'm guessing hell no.

    Homestar, just to reiterate what orgg and Isty said, normally you only draw one card a turn, right? So if somehow you can "break" that rule and draw more than one card a turn, you see more of your deck and can play more spells than your opponents. And don't worry about decking yourself; after games, see how many cards are left in your library. You usually have about half left - that's around 30 cards if you're playing a 60 card deck. That would be a lot of drawing and not winning to deck yourself :)
  11. Homestar Who invited this guy?

    well yea this is all good and yea, orgg, its me, homestar037 from MOL. but ne wayz. in my deck i have 4 isochron sceptars and 4 infiltrates. i put an infiltrate on a sceptar and power up my aven farseer. then with the rest of the sceptars i try to get my 3 astral steels on them and use them and infiltrate in one turn while every turn im makin my aven farseer stronger and stronger, then i make him even stronger with whatever astral steels i can get out then io make him unblockable. it works for me but u guys might think its "Janky". o yea and i have 2 echo tracers. i have aven liberator and frontline strategist and korona zealot and willbender etc. i think i have seen aphetto runecaster b4 so i can get him i think. and plus, this stuff im namin isnt to good cuz i have only been playin for 2 months but im tryin as hard as i can. the deck works well for me. and plus. when i get aven farseer out and he isnt workin for me, i have i think 2 power conduits in that deck so i can transfer the counters and stuff.
  12. orgg Administrator

    The deck sounds pretty fun, actually...

    One issue: many on the board may use the word 'gay' in their life, but none use it in a derogatory sense. If you think that we'd feel the deck was not solid and odd, the word 'janky' would be more appropriate. The word 'jank' and 'janky' have been with Magic for many years, and conveys the same sentiment you have.
  13. train The Wildcard!!!...

    that's just janky...;)
  14. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    I usually catch those but must have missed that, orgg... I edited it until Homestar wants to re-edit it.
  15. Homestar Who invited this guy?

    o.k now back to the original problem. i was playin my friend the other day and i did what spidey said i could with the wall (turn him down them morph him up and over and over) until i ran outta mana. my firnd thought i was cheating but then i showed him this thread and he still thinks im cheating. soooo does that mean that with any morph cards i can play them then flip em on the same turn?
  16. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    First of all, why does your friend think it's cheating?

    But yes, you can play a face-down card for 3 colorless and flip him over in the same turn, if you have the mana to do so...
  17. Istanbul Sucker MCs call me sire.


    As long as you have the mana to flip something, you can flip it.
    Does your friend think it's cheating if you play Frozen Shade's activated ability more than once in a turn?
    Because that's really all you're doing here: playing a card's activated ability as often as you have mana to do so.
    Now, if it TAPPED the Wall of Deceit, that would be different. But it doesn't, so I think your friend is just mad that you've got a very effective way of making huge Aven Farseers.
  18. Homestar Who invited this guy?

    my friend thinks im cheating cuz he duznt think that i should be able to flip him over then up etc. in the same turn cuz i made my aven farseer a 20/20 in like 3 or 4 turns cuz it was late in the game. but yea thats cool, i didnt kno i could do that.
  19. orgg Administrator

    Homestar, The Comprehensive Rules might help out with your friends... The accusations of things that are within the rules being unfair is part of the aforementioned 'growing pains' I referenced earlier.

    The official rules are at

    Print those out if you want to. They read like stereo instructions, but it's the best reference for times like you describe.

    It's also avaible at crystalkeep.com, but it takes some looking around. There's also a rulings search engine, but some of its information is out of date.
  20. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    What? You're not saying you completely missed my point, are you? I meant that Ancestral Recall is a very good card, and because it draws cards. You know, like maybe I should have said "compare Ancestral Recall to Giant Growth" or something like that...

    I didn't mean he should try to get it...

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