Slowly, but surely...

Discussion in 'General CPA Stuff' started by Zadok001, Mar 31, 2000.

  1. Zadok001 CPA Founder, Greater Good

    "Friday - 24 March 2000"

    That's the date at the top of the Dojo.

    Wakefield abandoned the Dojo some time ago, in fact, he abandoned Magic as a whole. Perhaps he will return some day, but when and if he does, where will he go?

    Several weeks ago, the message boards had an error message which forced the denizens of the Dojo to abandon their message boards to these. (Mind you, I'm very happy those guys found somewhere to go, they're wonderful to discuss with.) The Dojo boards are now completely innaccessable. The articles on the Dojo have ceased to have anything remotely interesting, Casual Fridays and (sometimes) Zvi's stuff aside.

    Ya' know what? It's Friday. I don't question the comptetance of Alongi, he has probably written an article for this week. And it's nowhere to be seen. The Dojo LITERALLY hasn't updated in a week. At all.

    There's a quote on Meridian Magic right now, everyone go there (, and read the two quotes at the top of the page. He's right. The Dojo is either dead and gone, or in it's final hours. If there is no update by halfway through next week, I do believe nothing will be able to revive the site.

    The Dojo was the premire site for Magic online. It's gone. Btw, this is not meant to be a diss on the Dojo. It's just informing everyone who doesn't already know. The Dojo is dead.

    "Game over, man. Game over."
  2. galtwish Loudmouth

    "Dojo decks" will always be there, wether on Mindripper, Meridian, Newwave or another site. Heck, I've even seen people play near copies of the decks I put out, and I've played Cand!man decks, at least for playtesting. Net decks are an intregal part of online Magic.
    The passing of the Dojo from Frank's hands was like the begining of T2; it created a more sterile, mechanical, $$ tournament-oriented environment. It was necessary, but painful. Where to now? Many are mourning the death of T2 now, as it isn't really supported by WOTC (sans the recent Friday Night Magic). The Dojo is needing an electro-shock rehabilitation too.
    In the meantime, I would suggest getting the meat and potatoes of your strategy diet at the above sites, with some on the side. What, no shameless plug? No. Starcity is a Magic community, and more focused on having fun while being competitive. Not to say that the writers aren't good players, but rather the decks and ideas discussed are the fringe elements of tech. We don't write for the Pro Tour, we write for your local weekly tournament or PTQ. This could make it more appropriate, but don't look for a lot of name recognition.

  3. theorgg Slob

    Actually, msot of ya'll know that the dojo is upheld by Al Tran and EDT and and and one day, at band camp...

    the thing is, all of theese people are IN COLLEDGE!

    what are half the colleges in the U>S>A. doing this WEEK?????

    anyone remember to factor in SPRING BREAK into this equation?

    It'll be back in a week.

    I hope.

    Despite it screwing us along w/ Doust, I LIKED it for some of the articals.
    I'm a tournament player at heart--albiet one that likes to have fun. I just don't have the money.
  4. Gizmo Composite: 1860

    The Dojo was the greatest thing Magic has ever had - it was the reason why Magic took off as a proper game not just a pastime.

    I loved The Dojo but what it has given to the Magic community has spread so far that The Dojo is no longer needed. Decktech is now everywhere, on message boards like this, on internet mailing lists like Meridian, on other sites like Starcity and NewWave. The Dojo has long gone, but the spirit of The Dojo will live on in every player - serious or casual, beginner or pro - who has ever pulled a deck idea, or a card use, or a playing suggestion, or a strategy tip from ANYWHERE on the internet.
    The Dojo internationalised Magic, and turned groups of four lonely guys sitting in a dark shop corner into being part of a huge great global community, a family even.
    The Dojo`s legacy is great and can never be erased.

    Do you mourn a caterpillar when it becomes a butterfly?
    The Dojo is dead - long live The Dojo!
  5. galtwish Loudmouth

    I was waiting for someone to say that...all hail Giz, for he is truly a giant among men. All Stephern Wright saracasm aside, what self-respecting Magic Player isn't playing Magic like crazy during Spring break to get ready for regionals and GP trials. At least they could have left us a message. The Onion takes a week off every couple months and no one thinks they've died because they leave a message, DON"T YOU THINK! YOU'RE MOTHER AND I HAVE BEEN WORRIED SICK ABOUT YOU! USE THE PHONE, DAMMIT, YOU'RE 17 NOW, CALL US TO LET US KNOW WHEN YOU'RE GOING TO BE LATE! YOU COULD HAVE BEEN HIT BY A CAR, OR Stolen by junkies, or murdered by satanists....
    sorry, flashback to dating in high school there. "Actually dad, I was making out, so I wasn't thinking about the phone..." Goid, I hated high school.

  6. I sent email to The Dojo a couple of days ago (who knows if anyone will ever read it?) saying basically the same thing.

    I told them that they should be ashamed for squandering away the best Magic site on the net.

    Do you know what some sites do to get as many hits as The Dojo used to get? They spend lots and lots of money on promotion and advertising. The Dojo had this and just let it go away.

    As I told them, if they can't update more than once a week, they should let competent, caring professionals take it over, or just shut it down until such time as they can give it the attention it deserves. I hope they treat their other customers better, or they'll be out of a job.
  7. Istanbul Sucker MCs call me sire.

    The Dojo is dead?



    The Dojo is a BLIGHT on the Magic community. Its deck postings discourage creativity, it promotes an elitist attitude towards 'non-Dojo' decks...I've long said that the best thing the Dojo could do for Magic would be to shut down, and maybe it finally has!

    Oh please, oh PLEASE, let it be so!
  8. Leshrac New Member

    The story I've heard is that the owner/operator of the site (I'm guessing Mike Flores, since he's the editor, but I guess it could be Al Tran, too) just got married and was on his honeymoon the past week. The source I heard this from gives me reason to believe it, but I'm still concerned that there was no mention of the site going down before it did (like there was before the staff went to one of the GPs or PTs). What concerns me the most isn't that there haven't been any updates (hey, everyone needs a break now and then), but that there's been no explanation posted by them as to what's going on.

    The other thing I'm rather concerned with is that The Dojo could potentially be in some serious legal trouble with IGN. I don't know the specifics of their contract since they signed on with IGN a long time ago, but if I don't make content updates at least once a week, I'm in breech of contract and could be sued by IGN. Now, I don't think IGN would really do anything quite yet, but if they didn't update for, say, a month and the press and work on them becomes very unfavorable, they may take action.
  9. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant


    It is kind of discouraging that the Dojo hasn't been updated for a while and like Leshrac said, without any notice why (or any previous warning that there weren't going to be any updates for a while). However, if Psylum is really the company it claims to be, one person going away on their honeymoon should not bring the whole site to a halt.

    <eyes misting with nostalgia> Wish it were just like it was when Frank ran it, a collection of the "best of" threads from other Magic areas, not these feature writers and emphasis on tournament information.

    On the other hand, what good sites are out there now? Gizmo mentioned Star City and NewWave. Brainburst seems to come to my mind too. I haven't visited these places just because I have so many websites already; do these places cover "community" concerns like the Dojo did? That's pretty much what I'm interested in.

    Quite honestly, I'm a bit confused about this site. It seems to have started out with high intentions about "changing the card sets so they have more casual play" or something to that effect. But it has pretty much degenerated/evolved into a forum where the "old" regulars from the Dojo boards come to gather (a little "coffee house") with a trickle of newcomers (from the Dojo boards). With the exception of TomB lately, the article section has lain fallow.

    I'm just mentioning this because if you're slamming on the Dojo, whether it's warranted or not, someone also ought to take an "outside" look here. "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone" and all that...
  10. Gizmo Composite: 1860

    You make a valid point - I got here just before most of the other Dojo people, but when I heard that the Dojo regulars were coming here I was a little concerned that we/they would wreck the atmosphere of the CPA.
    I don`t think that has happened yet, but maybe I`m a little more tolerant of tech discussions, seeing as I`m a total tech-head myself.

    Community Issues: You mean biased rants that cannot achieve anything because everybody already has their opinions entrenched? No, I don`t think anybody covers them any more except the Dojo, because they are pretty dull to be honest. Starcity occasionally gets threads up about random stuff, Re: Making Maro, and their Standard Pro-Tour drive - but they are all tournament based.

    And I don`t really think that the CPA would ever realistically have expected to see card designs coming out specifically for casual paly, but you have to admit that MM and NM have been great for casual play and we know that WotC do check up on all the boards, both here and at the Dojo, so the CPA`s existence is being taken into account. but I feel I`m not the best qualified person to comment on the success of the CPA`s objectives - maybe Ed or Zadok have something to say?
  11. Ura Feline Lord of the Pit

    Well, its 3:30pm PST and the dojo still hasn't updated.
    I just checked it out, are they truely dead or just really slow at getting back to work after spring break or what?
  12. Duel Has Less Posts Than Spiderman

    YES! Someone besides me has seen the trend. MM and NM have seen the advent of the Killer common, and the pointless rare!
  13. Chaos Turtle Demiurgic CPA Member, Admin Assistant

    Actually, pointless rares have been around a long time...
    Wasn't Hymn to Tourach a killer common?
  14. TomB Administrative Assistant

    So was Lightning Bolt, for that matter. ;)

    An interesting point you made, Spiderman, about how the original purpose of our site seems to have gotten lost in this wave of new members. For all of you who are new here, this is the mission statement written by Tony Scott, aka Baron Sengir, and it's actually a copy of the letter he wrote to the Dojo introducing the site to the Magic community at large.

    Personally, I thought we were striving to affect a little more than just trying to get a few more "casual play" cards released. I think we were trying to get the Magic community overall, and WotC in particular, to sit up and take notice of the opinions and needs of non-pro players everywhere, both in terms of the card sets and in terms of rules changes, and bannings.

    That the game itself has been altered radically over the last 2 years is undeniable. Most feel the changes overall were for the better, yet some of us continue to clamor for a return to the old days. I admit, that I am one of those, and that I look to the CPA as a way to express that. I realize many others here feel otherwise, but that's okay, because only of such diversity of opinion can true consensus be born.

    Yet the only measure I can think of for guaging that consensus opinion would be the voting booth. I think that if the site is to fulfill it's ultimate goal, that of telling WotC how we feel about their decisions concerning our game (like, for example, the Dark Ritual banning) we need to get these issues up for a vote, tally that vote, and publicise the results, either in an open letter to the company or by posting it on the front page. We certainly have the numbers to do it now.

    If we can start doing that in a timely manner, we can make this site into what it was truly meant to be. For everyone.

    CPA Member

    [Edited by TomB (04-08-2000 at 01:51 AM).]
  15. Leshrac New Member

    You know, someone should really start a new topic on the CPA's "evolution," so that it doesn't get lost in this thread.
  16. Gizmo Composite: 1860

    Apparently The Dojo is bankrupt.
    That`s the rumour.
  17. Zadok001 CPA Founder, Greater Good

    I think the nessicity of the CPA has faded somewhat, not to say we should disband. The CPA was formed heavily because of the influx of broken cards through Urza's Block. By the time we got notable membership (i.e., around now) that problem has been at least somewhat solved with MM and Nemesis, which sport exactly ZERO obviously broken cards.

    We still need to exist. We can be considered a barricade of sorts, to keep WotC from returning to the day of 10,000 broken combos per set. That is what I view our purpose as now. No longer are we here to get WotC and the DCI on the right track (in terms of broken cards, anyways...). We are here to _keep_ them on the right track.

    "Defender of the Faith..."
  18. The Magic Jackal Veteran CPA Member<BR><font co

    In response to Gizmo: Your absolutely right, the dojo members could ruin this place in a second flat, maybe less. BUT, I think that we have done a good job of toning it down. Personally, when i am writing a response to a deck or something, I find myself being really intense with tech and stuff like that. Then i rember this is a CASUAL board, and I hit the "clear feilds" button and start over the message, but i try to look at it in a Non-tournament player style. I have had many dojo members comment on how I no longer post in-depth messages about decks. It's because I don't think that what people want here. Although, if you do want that, I'll be happy to take a look at it. And I will contiue to do my best to not disturb this board.

    BTW Gizmo:

  19. Zadok001 CPA Founder, Greater Good

    Welcome to the world of the dead, Gizmo. :) J/K.

    True enough, the CPA is becoming more of a coffee house than a true alliance with actually actions being taken. But I emphasize: WotC is doing _exactly_ what we originally set out to get them to do. Unless something changes in that respect (i.e., they reprint Tolarian Academy and Bargain in 7th, and Prophecy resembles Destiny on the power curve), the CPA can remain without an enormous amount of influence on the outside world.

    As I said before, Defenders of the Faith.

    "And in the meantime, let the good times roll!"
  20. Chaos Turtle Demiurgic CPA Member, Admin Assistant

    I second that!
    <font size="2" color="#FF6000">* Chaos Turtle raises a pint of, Pepsi</font>

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