Random Thoughts about 8th Edition.

[BigBlue]

I agree that all the painlands should be a staple now. Magic is very multi-color oriented and those lands make it accessible. One big worry with that however is the number of rares slots which will be devoted to those lands. I'd say the City goes by the wayside if they do 10 painlands. the other option is to bring in the tapped allied non-painlands as unc and eliminate the allied painlands, but I don't like that much either.

It will be interesting to see what other IN stuff makes it in (or doesn't). Also if there are any surprise returns from the Urza or Masques series. Given the change in extended, this will be an interesting set from that standpoint as well.

Will we see the first gold cards in a basic set? If so which ones would you like to see?

Which 7th edition cards deserve retirement? Will BoP go the way of the Dodo? How will the "playing with the Pie" come into play in the new basic set?

These questions should make for interesting conversation.

 

[rkoelsch]

Unless there is some reversal at WOTC there wouldn't be any gold cards. They have stated in the past that Gold cards are for the advanced sets. If BOP rotated out what an uproar that would cause. The more I think about it the less likely it seems that they will reprint the Apoc lands. It fit when they pushed multicolor but doesn't really go with there simpler is better format.

 

[BigBlue]

Yeah, I'd agree since they feel so compelled to make the basic sets "basic". I really think that they should reprint those lands, but then they aren't needed for extended as IN-cycle is of course still available. I just liked seeing it easier to play opposing colors. I really don't care too much what they reprint other than from what I like about the game and would like to see remain in their current environment. I haven't bought any basic cards since 5th, and those were few. The painlands just made sense to me, if you expect a land to be multipurpose you should take some damage, and as colorless providers they were very useful.

If they made the whole set of painlands available, then I see no need for birds, and they've taken every other reason to play green out, so why not remove Birds too. It would just go to prove they hate Green.

What sets are elligible as first time to basic? Masques? Urzas? Invasion?

 

[Captain Caveman]

Like I said in the article, I think the "basic" edition should have
the foundation for each color to see play. I'm going to assume
that WoTc will print a few new multi-colored cards in each
Stand Alone set. By reprinting the pain-lands or the Invasion
block lands in the basic edition they would have a few slots
open to print cards tailor made for that block. (Be it special lands
or other spells)


Alpha, Beta and Unlimited had the Dual lands to support allied
and non-allied color decks and I believe Richard intended it to
always be that way.(opinion)


As far as what other cards should be in the basic edition, I like
the idea of a few cards rotating out but some should be staples.
I believe Birds of Paradise should be a staple.


I think it will be difficult to pick Invasion and Masques block cards
to reprint. A lot of those cards are confined to the block. Rebels,
fading and gold spells made up the majority of the tournament
cards. Some of the other cards a good but do we want FtK,
Powder Keg, Thrashing Wumpus, FoF and Academy Rector back
in standard? The Wumpus might be ok but those other cards
are pretty strong. Accumulated Knowledge would be kind of
nice though.

Caveman

 

[Spiderman]

Although I don't really care about what goes in 8th because they're all reprints, it would be interesting to have cards rotate out one set and back in the next, like BoPs. Or have some stay for two sets, rotate out a set, come back in for two sets, etc. Just so the environment changes for a while but you know they're coming back so you don't get rid of them.

 

[Purple_jester]

Birds stay. So do the Elves. Remember the line in that hated Buehler article? Something about green's weenies not getting much better than birds and grizzly bears.

Gold cards will not be in a basic set. R&D has declared that if it reprints Gold cards, then they will be reprinted in the Expert sets, either in original form or with a different name. Example: Lobotomy.

Also, with the duals rotating out of Extended, reprinting ALL painlands, including those from Apocalypse, are a must. Ditto for City of Brass.

Which brings to mind another question. With Extended Rotating the way it is, will this mean that Dark Ritual may make it back into T2? After all, most if not all of the cards that got it banned in Extended are gone now...

 

[Gizmo]

The Invasion duals wont be in 8th, Id happily wager $100 on that fact right here, right now. Real money.

I dont follow any reasoning that would link the Extended format rotation to reprinting the Invasion lands, as the invasion lands will be legal in extended for around another 6 years at least anyway, and there are more than enough of them in circulation already.

Dark Ritual was banned because it is broken.
It is still broken.
I hope they nail the oinker down so it cant rise from the grave.

 

[Purple_jester]

Actually Giz, I was thinking the Invasion painlands would be in 8th so that they'd still be legal for the T2 people. Of course, they might decide to lean away from opposing colors come Onslaught.

I certainly wouldn't mind more of them in circulation. That usually means the price goes down, and that's good news for me, since I've still got some way to go in completing them all.

 

[Istanbul]

Er...I assume you're all talking about the Apocalypse painlands?

 

[BigBlue]

But as Gizmo pointed out, it would only be for standard as IN Block won't be taken out of Extended for some time.

I guess if 8th is going to remain "basic" then I can see the opposite colors not being included as those are "advanced" concepts to a degree in WotC's twisted universe.

I'm a heretic for suggesting that Green lose BoP. Of course I think G needs something, just that Birds is a Liability for G getting anything. As long as WotC can point to "But G has Birds...", they'll never give it good cards in this players view. And besides what good are Birds in a Mono-Green Deck? Is G expected to be used solely as a utility color in 5-Color Decks? How weak is that crap.

The colors should be able to stand on their own and at least compete, G doesn't have that, and never has imho. Heck even a straight Artifact deck could beat G consistently, it just lacks any real bite (oh wait there is Unyaro Bee Sting).

G deserves a piece of the Pie, and it shouldn't have to depend on using other colors or built around that aspect.

Lately I'm letting Rakso's article get under my skin and it taints all my other posts. sorry.

 

[Duel]

I'm not nearly as sure as Gizmo that Painlands from invasion won't come back. Hey, they used Elvish Champion! That was alot closer to printing time....

What I hope comes back is Armageddon. But in this format....

Oh well.... maybe in 9th....

 

[Mikeymike]

I think Gizmo is talking about the Invasion CIP-tapped duals, but he can answer for himself.

I have no issues with Dark Ritual never being printed again. Dark Ritual's existence for many years has probably prevented many good black cards from ever seeing print - or making them get delayed in their print run.

One thing in 8th I hope WOTC continues to do is print cards that weren't great/tourney worthy when they were originally printed, but become much better in the new environment - like Static Orb.

 

[Gizmo]

I meant the opposing-color painlands, from Apocalypse.

 

[Mikeymike]

I would be wrong then. What makes you think that they won't be reprinted in 8th?

Elvish Champion was a wasted card slot in 7th.

 

[Gizmo]

The opposing color bit was a block-specific mechanic, and they wont put the lands to support it into a basic set like 8th. Magic is SUPPOSED to be based around friendly colors, Apocalypse and Planeshift just changed the rules for a couple of years, but it`s only a passing phase.

 

[Mikeymike]

Cool, makes sense.

 

[Istanbul]

Planeshift didn't support opposite-color spells. That was an Apocalypse thing.

 

[Captain Caveman]

I disagree. Alpha, Beta and Unlimited had non-allied color land
and there were not any opposing color spells in that group
(there might have been, I'm not sure what was out by the
release of Unlimited.)

Why is it be so difficult to believe that the base set could return
to it foundation?

 

[Gizmo]

Alpha, Beta, and Unlimited also had Moxes and Time Walks.
They won`t be in 8th either, because Magic has grown up since then.

I`ll be happy to take your money off you if you like, Caveman.

 

[TomB]

And the implied need for it, you don't have to be so nasty Gizmo. CC is just trying to stimulate conversation about 8th, and he is as entitled to his opinions concerning non-allied duals as you are to your opinions about them.

Personally, I agree with CC. I think non-allied duals were good for the game, but then, my favorite color combination to play is probably Red-White...