Merry Christmas vs. Happy Holidays

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HOUTS

Guest
"It's his "facts" mixed with a dash of "your wrong" and a sprinkle of "like it or don't", which is all fine because he can say whatever he wants to say."
I agree with everything except the "his facts". I am literate folks. If you want me to post "my facts", I'll gladly do so. But, you can attain this knowledge by just reading. *shrug*
I'll be happy to provide any sources/books if asked.

"...been my intent in this thread to address the folks who freakin' INSIST that Merry Christmas is THEE ONLY GREETING and to say otherwise is blasphemy or santanic."
I reread everything...and, I didn't see your "intent", only what you wrote. Now, read what I wrote. I didn't address those Nazi' greeting freaks. You are correct on one thing-I say thing most people won't.


It's funny. After rereading all the responses, including flames, I've yet to see anyone actually present a rebuttal against what I said. All I see is "Houts is opinionated...blah, blah". Or, "Houts talks out of his oink...blah, blah"
Then, I look again. Nope. Not one actual spec. No worries, folks. I don't get insulted easily.
"Flame on!"
Go at it!

-HOUTS
 

turgy22

Nothing Special
HOUTS - I'm not rebutting anything you said because I don't disagree with any of it except for your continued misreading of my statements. I will give one last example to try to clarify this and then perhaps attempt a HOUTS-ian explanation and see if that gets through.

Twice you said that I feel bad saying Merry Christmas. This is false. I don't feel bad, it's just not a greeting I like to use. For example, a lot of Irish people I know like to say, "Top of the mornin' to you!" I don't say this because I don't like it as a greeting. Same with Merry Christmas.

HOUTS mode: ON

I am literate folks.
Well then why don't you try using that literacy and READ! I don't know about your facts, but your interpretation of other people's facts are way off the mark. Get it right or stop trying!

HOUTS mode: OFF

Sorry about the quasi-flame. I don't want people to think that HOUTS is getting on my nerves. I just don't like arguing with walls.
 
H

HOUTS

Guest
"HOUTS - I'm not rebutting anything you said because I don't disagree with any of it except for your continued misreading of my statements....
Twice you said that I feel bad saying Merry Christmas. This is false"
I didn't misread anything you said. Nor did you provide anything I've said to show my supposed "misrepresentation" of what you said. If so, then please point it out. Your last few replies have lacked in such, so I will help you out. I will clarify how I could confuse your puzzling logic as being "feelism".


"I don't say it because I'm trying to avoid offending anyone, but because I just think it sounds awkward."
I love sentences like this. Logic 101! You think it is awkward when saying, obviously, to others. So, you're NOT trying to offend anyone? Do you want to rethink this? And you "think" it sounds awkward. This sounds like a determination based on human experience rather than actual facts. You FEEL that it sounds awkward to others, if not offending. You even back it up with your story of a jewish friend...
*Scratches head*


"I'll say it to my friends at church and at family gatherings because it seems appropriate then, but otherwise I feel it's just sort of a stupid greeting / salutation."
Wow, geez, how can HOUTS not understand what I'm saying?!
Words like 'seems' (indefinitive, based off own experience) and "FEEL".


"But I can imagine it must be a lot harder for a non-Christian living in this predominantly Christian country to endure a barrage of Merry Christmases especially with the way the holiday is so over-comercialized these days."
Imagine what? Is this, yet again, another opinion based off your own knowledge through experience? Or, are you going back this claim up with references?
If not, then how am I so biased, opinionated, and arrogant, when all you do is the same thing I do: present your own experiences. But, I do bring in some facts. You say my own facts. Really? Yet, you don't ask for my sources. You just belittle ignorantly without validation. Honestly, you don't know that the majority of Americans are catholic/christians? Would you like to know how to find this out?
Or, maybe a few history books on mid-east and urban culture?
You really have no idea of a person's background/education. You PRESUME I am without both-and once again-incorrect.

"But I have a feeling that the crazies who are insisting on saying "Merry Christmas" would have a problem and would probably wish that everyone was just wishing them a happy holiday instead"
There is that "feel" word again.
-But HOUTS, you're taking my words out of context to feed upon your arguements!

Yep, taking your words per beta. If you lead off that sentence with, for example: According to Left, ....

But, you talk about "Crazies" and your feeling of what they say/think.
I was disputing the attack that we shouldn't use it. I didn't say you MUST EVERY TIME. Rather that your opinions, from my own opinions & facts, are biased.


"But when I hear myself say it as a general greeting, I think it sounds awkward."
Yes, to you it does. Before this whole media storm, it wasn't a factor. Noone talked, cared, thought about it. A few businesses might have done their own thing, but it wasn't hyped, and caught on trendily, as it has this past year.

But, your last sentence is best:
"I don't know about your facts..."
You're right about that. You've yet to ask. Nor did you look into it.

"interpretation of other people's facts"
Where? Use an example!

I just see flaming, and the tired attempt to attack me. That is fine. I am used to the CPA mentality commonly displayed here. That is why I am the "Evil One"
Yet, I still get responses. If I am so ignorant, biased, opinionated, arrogant, and "walled", then why do I see so many replies? Why even try to refute?

-HOUTS
 
D

DÛke

Guest
Good god.

HOUTS, this is my advice for you:

Leave this place, because you are too good for it. I sincerely say that, because from my own experiences, some moderators who shall remain nameless have, in the past, censored my posts without any other reason than that they themselves, and they alone, found my thoughts and questions to be "of offensive nature." And guess what? No one had done anything about it, no one cared, even though I brought it to their attention and felt seriously wronged.

In the CPA, as you very well know, no one cares about your opinion unless:

1. You're a moderator, founder, or web-master.

2. You're a dumb-a** whack-job who conceals stupidity under a less than amusing but whacky sense of humor.

3. You go with the flow, agree to disagree, and litter your posts with tons of manic ":)" so as to not step on anyone's little toes, even if the person is dead wrong.

If you don't fit into one or more of those three categories, then you are an outcast to this place, no matter how rational, intelligent, and devout. They will not ban you - I promise - because they have that whiff of political correctness about them. But they will ignore you to death, or, better yet (for them), they'll pretty much attack you every and any time you say something, no matter how true it is.

I'm not complaining, and I don't care, really. I care about your presence here, HOUTS, which is, honestly, underappreciated and despised, sure, sometimes for your forthcoming attitude (i.e., your "delivery"), but mostly, and truly, because you are right most of the times, or at least, no one can prove you wrong most of the times.

You probably know this, but - people don't want to test their own mislead opinions (which they call "facts"), so any substance or entity that can potentially threaten their "facts" and forces them to think will not be tolerated under any circumstances. Which, as you can witness, is the reason why members slowly disappear here: because content is banned, and banality is affirmed and appreciated.

As for the issue at hand: anyone saying "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas" needs to see a psychiatrist. And please don't try to say you've always been politically correct - no, you aren't. You only started because you go with the flow, with the commercial, with the advertisement. That's it. Period. In short, because you are mindless.
 
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evan d

Guest
Killer Joe said:
Happy Holidays because my religion promtes harmony among all people of the world?Isn't the New Year Holiday basically a pegan observance? Oh boy, what do I say now? I need to check my local non-politically correct Repulican web-site for more info. :rolleyes:
I nearly spit on my screen at the first part. Catholocism a religion thats promotes harmony... Right and history is forgotten.

Record: I', athistic/agnostic/I'll care when i'm dieing. I Still say merry christmas because thats what I mean. I don't care if your hannakuah or whatever is lame as can be, because christmas is teh only holdiay of those that matters to me. Right now it is christmas break not hannakuah break or whatever. I truely don't care if you have a happy holiday, just a merry christmas. Also becuase christmas has things good for me. Mistletoe and teh ladies, and presents.



way off side note: Why do some catholics teach thier kids to believe in santa. I personally think the guy loopy. Has kids sit on his lap, give away without return, and is obese. Thats almost the opposite of goodness, yet he is the epitome of demigodly goodness.
 
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HOUTS

Guest
First off, thanks for the replies. Usually I could care less if someone does/does not agree with my viewpoints, stance, or opinoins, but this time around I appreciate the sincerity Killer Joe & Duke.

"Your "delivery" of your messeage(s) is what *ticks* people off (no facts needed for this just recall all the flames you've recieved )."

Oh, I realize my "delivery" creates a negative persona. And, how I say things. However, I've said, since I've been here at CPA (since 1999/2000) that I am not here to be 'loved' or 'liked'. I'll say what I want, however I want, and that is it. Sounds pretty harsh? You bet!
The irony is that if you met me, in which noone here has, you wouldn't even know who I was.["Fat Man" has, but he isn't a CPA'er] Reality: likeable, humble person.My persona put forth is one I created and want. Everyone has one. Jamie Wakefield is the loveable tournament player on-line. Reality: Harsh, cruel, man-killer. :)
There is one thing you can expect from me: honesty. I won't pull punches, kiss ass, or act as if I know something I don't. Hence why I don't write on the fourms alot.
Too much bull****. I just can't take it.
I've written for every site that is out there. Yes, SCG, BB, MTG, etc. All of them. I've played casually to competitively (Pro Tour). I am educated:three degrees across the board. Yet, you don't see my spouting my arrogance over any of this. Only to prove I know that I'm no kid.
However, over the years I've seen more ignorant and blind statements. Usually I give people a chance to prove themself, but I find that 99% of the CPA'ers here aren't people I'd ever associate with, or find a conversation even intelligable. Unless that is their persona.

"As for the rest of us we should learn not to take your posts so seriously, your "message(s)", yes, but not your delivery."
True dat. How come they haven't figured this out yet?

"Leave this place, because you are too good for it"
The only reason I don't is because this is MY place too. I don't care WHO moderates it. Unless they want to try (and I do mean "try) banning my access here, I will always be flexing my Matrix Muscles here. I wrote when I was still that casual/semi-compeitive [this definition applied goes against my real definition but I am using it to exemplify my scenario] player who found comfort in writing my on-line journal: CPA articles. I find comfort in fighting the utter stupidity that has grown like poison ivy across this site. I'm that pit bull marking my terrain with a big yellow "X".

"Leave this place, because you are too good for it. I sincerely say that, because from my own experiences, some moderators who shall remain nameless have, in the past, censored my posts without any other reason than that they themselves, and they alone, found my thoughts and questions to be "of offensive nature." And guess what? No one had done anything about it, no one cared, even though I brought it to their attention and felt seriously wronged.

In the CPA, as you very well know, no one cares about your opinion unless:

1. You're a moderator, founder, or web-master.

2. You're a dumb-a** whack-job who conceals stupidity under a less than amusing but whacky sense of humor.

3. You go with the flow, agree to disagree, and litter your posts with tons of manic "" so as to not step on anyone's little toes, even if the person is dead wrong.

If you don't fit into one or more of those three categories, then you are an outcast to this place, no matter how rational, intelligent, and devout. They will not ban you - I promise - because they have that whiff of political correctness about them. But they will ignore you to death, or, better yet (for them), they'll pretty much attack you every and any time you say something, no matter how true it is."
Wow, you've hit the nail on the head. So, my friend, the questions goes back to you. What keeps you here if you feel this way?
I absolutely agree with everything you wrote.

A few years ago I wrote an article using the word "****", used correctly (and don't even try to attack this arguement, as it is pointless) in my article. However, instead of receiving some 'good' feedback, or witty replies, all I received as stupid remarks of "Don't swear again..blah, blah". I thought-how pointless. Then the moderator got on his high horse to show how big he was. The troops, of course, mindlessly followed with.
HOUTS this is a family website...we don't permit that kind of language...this is not the Internet, we are the Nazi reigm....
So, I stopped writing.
Then I realized how dumb for me to run from idiots, even if they ran this site. I came back and did want I wanted.

Recently I replied back, and even put it into article format, rebutting some idiot reponses. Did I swear? Nope. But I used big words like "Idiot" and used offensive words in the viewpoint of our 12 year old moderator. Spidey**** even declined it-obviously.
Censorship. Good job!
They even tried to maintain that people aren't leaving this site. Really? But I've pointed out numerous users who've left, and I have a few e-mails from those who hated coming here.



-HOUTS
 
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HOUTS

Guest
"Yes, we're MORONS, deal with it!!!!!!"
Thanks, I wanted clarification in writing. This now helps me understand all the stupidity going on at this site. Great way of backing up anything we've attacked.
You've created a great quote for me-thanks.

-HOUTS

Stupid quote of the year:
"Besides, an intelligent person, such as yourself and HOUTS too, do not need curse words to get your point across."
Do I need even say more?


-HOUTS
 
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evan d

Guest
The only real reason why I stay here is because I have allways found value in the posts, even ransac's randomnimity. My case in point is teh 10 page thread on intelligent design. Most other websites would have bogged down into mudslinging or what I think is worst of all, is teh "I'm right, and I know you are wrong, And I can't prove it, but I'm right and you are wrong".
 
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HOUTS

Guest
Killer: IT was a joke.

(plane flys over)

Sorry you missed it.

Nothing but love...

-HOUTS
 
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Arix

Guest
I just have one thing to say on the Merry Christmas/Happy Holidays thing - political correctness has gone way too far. It's only a matter of time before we have to call Big Bird, "Avian of Substantial Magnitude".
 
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sageridder

Guest
Meh anyone who takes offence to a greeting of goodwill and cheer is just sporting for an argument.If someone was to react badly to a merry christmas, I would suggest a responce of "Oh I'm sorry I couldn't tell your religion by looking at you, maybe if everyone wore a badge denoting thier religion we could avoid this in the furture.......Oh wait they tried that with Jewish people before and I hear they didn't like it." Of course if that's to confrontational for you just hand out this form.

Holiday Greeting Acceptance Form

From me ("the Wishor") to you (hereinafter called the "Wishee"):

Please accept without obligation, implied or implicit, our best wishes for an environmentally conscious, socially responsible, politically correct, low stress, non-addictive, gender neutral, celebration of the winter solstice holiday, practiced within the most enjoyable traditions of the religious persuasion or secular practices of your choice with respect for the religious/secular persuasions and/or traditions of others, or their choice not to practice religious or secular traditions at all... and a financially successful, personally fulfilling and medically uncomplicated recognition of the onset of the generally accepted calendar year 2006, but with due respect for the calendars of choice of other cultures or sects, and having regard to the race, creed, color, age, physical ability, religious faith, choice of computer platform or dietary preference of the Wishee.

By accepting this greeting you are bound by these terms:

1. This greeting is subject to further clarification or withdrawal.

2. This greeting is freely transferable provided that no alteration shall be made to the original greeting and that the proprietary rights of the Wishor are acknowledged.

3. This greeting implies no promise by the Wishor to actually implement any of the wishes.

4. This greeting may not be enforceable in certain jurisdictions and/or the restrictions herein may not be binding upon certain Wishees in certain jurisdictions and is revocable at the sole discretion of the Wishor.

5. This greeting is warranted to perform as reasonably may be expected within the usual application of good tidings, for a period of one year or until the issuance of a subsequent holiday greeting, whichever comes first.

6. The Wishor warrants this greeting only for the limited replacement of this wish or issuance of a new wish at the sole discretion of the Wishor.

7. Any references in this greeting to "the Lord," "Father Christmas," "Our Savior," or any other festive figures, whether actual or fictitious, dead or alive, shall not imply any endorsement by or from them in respect of this greeting, and all proprietary rights in any referenced third party names and images are hereby acknowledged.
 
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HOUTS

Guest
Quite clever Sagerider.

"Merry Christmas!"

-"What? I'm jewish..."

"So? This is America. This is the 'Christmas' season. What do you expect?"

-"Happy holidays?"

"Sure, in Atheism land, or overseas of an otherwise predominant religion. But, here, it is MERRY CHRISTMAS"

Question: If you are born in America-aren't you american? Why is that if you are born in Germany, you're German, in China, you're 'chinese', but if you're born here, you're everything but American. *Scratches head* I don't get it. If you're jewish, and you're celebrating your own religious beliefs on American soil, how does being of American Nationality conflict with who you are? Does it mean you are stilll a 'jew' but just "living" in America (even if you were born here)? Aren't you an American who is 'jewish'? Thus, meaning you celebrate our holiday season, but on your own religious grounds?
After all, we have those who don't believe in God, Catholism, or Religion that still celebrate "Christmas" as a holiday, and take in the expressions, belief system, and rituals as their own. Isn't this an American Tradition? I fail to see how it is not.

-HOUTS
 
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Arix

Guest
I myself am an atheist. Though I don't believe in the origins of Christmas, I still celebrate the ideals and values behind it. But I don't celebrate, let's say, Hannukah. But you know what I'd do if a Jew came up to me and wished me a happy Hannukah? I wouldn't get all riled up and angry at them for assuming I celebrated the holiday. I wouldn't go off and complain about it. I'd just smile and wish them the same back. The only thing that would get me annoyed at religious people would be when they try to force their religion on me - but just wishing me goodwill and happiness? How can anyone possibly find that offensive? Chances are, it's more offensive to make people say "Happy Holidays" than it is allowing them to say "Merry Christmas".
 
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Chaos Turtle

Guest
Frankly I was shocked that this subject made it to national debate. The case that got this whole business started was Christian groups complaining that retail stores were using "Happy Holidays" in their merchandising instead of "Merry Christmas" and accused the stores of pandering to the liberal anti-God lobby. Some talking head mentions it on a 24-hour "news" channel an POW! --> national debate.

About what?

Laying aside the obvious fact that the only thing the retail sector caters to is money, what could possibly be offensive about wishing a person "Happy Holidays" other than that by which the wishee chooses to be offended? On the flip side, no one who was not seriously tight in the sphincter should be offended by "Merry Christmas."

The whole "debate" is absurd. Keep at it.

Mostly, I just wished folks a happy and safe weekend...I'm thoughtful like that...fa-la-la-la-laaaa...
 
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