Creatures that are directly superior to others?

A

arhar

Guest
I've been thinking... how many creatures can you name that are directly superior to some other ones? In everything except for creature type (for example, I heard an argument that Druid Lyrist is much better than Elvish Lyrist in Extended because of Engineered Plague and cards like that) I can think of:

Escape Artist and Metathran Soldier - both are 1/1 for 1U, unblockable, but you can return EA to your hand. It's funny, because back in the day when Destiny just came out, I only played for a couple of months and used to think it's a decent card :eek:

Multiple 2/2s for 2R with abilities and Grey Ogre

Multiple 2/2s for 1G with abilites and Grizzly Bears

Multiple 3/3s for 3R with abilities and Hill Giant :D

Kavu Agressor and Balduvian Barbarians - Both are 3/2 for 2R, but KA has a kicker.

Yavimaya Wurm and Craw Wurm - both are 6/4 for 4GG, but YW has trample.

Anything else?
 
I

Istanbul

Guest
Kavu Aggressor and Balduvian Barbarians don't work - 2R vs. 1RR.

About twelve thousand red creatures for R and Mons Goblin Raiders.
 
S

Spiderman

Administrator
Staff member
Are you talking about cards that are the same cc but superior? Or also early "cheap" cards that were "fixed" later with a higher cc (like Regrowth vs. Elven Cache)?
 
M

Mikeymike

Guest
Grey Ogre vs.
Sedge Troll
Granite Gargoyle
Arc Mage

Grizzly Bear vs.
Wild Mongrel
Spectral Bears
Nomadic Elf
Fresh Volunteers / Knight Errant

Hill Giant vs.
Warmonger
That cheesy dude from Mirage who can turn colorless
Phyrexian Scuta (does this count?)


Here is a slightly different comparison
Serra Angel vs.
Radiant Archangel
Wayward Angel
Avenging Angel
Lightning Angel
 
L

Lotus Mox

Guest
Dakmor Lancer vs.
Dark Hatchling

Goblin Hero vs.
Goblin Spelunkers
Goblin Chariot
Enslaved Scout
Goblin Cavaliers
Slingshot Goblin

Diabolic Tutor vs.
Demonic Tutor

Ironroot Treefolk vs.
Redwood Treefolk
Blanchwood Treefolk

Pearl Unicorn vs.
Regal Unicorn
Devout Witness
Knight Errant
Fresh Volunteers
Patrol Hound
Sunscape Battlemage
Soul Charmer
and many more :)

Ward of Lights, Lightning Reflexes, Mystic Veil vs.
Cho-Manno's Blessing, Flame Sword, Alexi's Cloak

Abandon Hope vs.
Last Rites

These are just the tip of the Iceberg ;)
 
S

Spiderman

Administrator
Staff member
I glossed over the "creature" in the title.

I don't know if you can compare Grizzly Bears to Spectral Bears. Isn't the latter 3/3 and has a condition on it?

Also, the comparison is probably only good within the same color and maybe within commonality (i.e. Benalish Hero vs. Timber Wolves).
 
F

FoundationOfRancor

Guest
I just scrolled down and posted this post without relizing it was about creatures, not all spells.
 
I

Istanbul

Guest
Eager Cadet vs.

Benalish Hero
Timber Wolves
Savannah Lions
Icatian Javelineers
Icatian Soldiers
Nomads En-Kor
Death Speakers
etc.

And if we go into non-creatures, the obvious comparison:

Shock vs. Lightning Bolt.
 
M

Mongoose Man

Guest
No no no, if it were non creatures it'd have to be singe V Bolt :p
 
I

Istanbul

Guest
The whole point of this is to find cards that are directly superior to others.

That means that they have an identical casting cost...are an identical type (no instant vs. sorcery), and there's an obvious superiority.

Steadfast Guard vs. White Knight doesn't work, for example, because while White Knight has first strike and pro: black, Steadfast Guard doesn't tap to attack...and while the White Knight gives a more effective combat creature, Steadfast Guard swings without making you worry about holding creatures back for defense. Neither is *better*, but both do something the other doesn't, making them simply *different*.

Eager Cadet vs. Savannah Lions works, however, because both cost W...both have 1 toughness...in fact, there's no difference between them except that Savannah Lions have an extra point of power, making them directly superior. Eager Cadet vs. Tundra Wolves also works, because while both cost W and both are 1/1s, one has first strike and the other doesn't.
 
T

Thallid Ice Cream Man

Guest
I disagree with the instant v. sorcery thing. Surely Lightning Bolt is better than Strafe?

Your criteria would also not allow Seeker of Skybreak vs. Fyndhorn Brownie, even though the former is superior 99.9999999999% of the time.
Seeker of Skybreak
1G
Creature - Elf
2/1
Tap: Untap target creature.

Fyndhorn Brownie
2G
Creature - Brownie
1/1
2G, Tap: Untap target creature.

Creature type is a factor so rarely that I don't think it should be considered except in cases like that of the Druid/Elvish Lyrist. And even then, Coat of Arms, another commonly used card, could help make them bigger.
Continuous abilities such as flying shouldn't make a creature directly superior, because there are lots of cards that affect flyers negatively as well as positively (certainly more than in the case of creature types).

Not only is Escape Artist better than Metathran Solider, Metathran Soldier (and thus Escape Artist) are both better than Hazy Homunculus and better than Sneaky Homunculus.

The most important reason that you can't compare Kavu Agressor and Balduvian Barbarians is not that one costs 2R and one costs 1RR (I have yet to see a card that favors a cost of 1RR over 2R), but that Kavu Agressor can't block. That's the main reason they are different cards.

And Singe isn't 100% directly inferior to Lightning Bolt - you could turn a big creature black and prevent it from attacking for a turn with Light of Day in play. :)
 
S

Spiderman

Administrator
Staff member
Well, as the title noted, I think this was supposed to talk about just creature comparisons, as you could get into Elven Cache vs. Regrowth, Balance vs. that other white spell, etc.

I don't think you can compare Seeker vs. Brownie because there's too many differences: casting cost, power/toughness, and cost of the ability. There's probably LOTS more if you want to take all of those variables in account.

I think the main idea is comparing what costs the same in that color and seeing which is better. Granite Gargoyles are far superior than Gray Ogre, because for the same cc in the same color, you get flying and pumpable toughness in the former. And they were even in the same set together!

And I think flying does make a difference because it's such a common evasive ability. I mean, given the chance, you try to take such creatures in draft, right?
 
I

Istanbul

Guest
By jove, I do believe he's got it.

We're comparing creatures, looking for ones that are *directly* superior. As in, creature A has abilities that creature B doesn't, and creature B doesn't have any abilities that creature A doesn't.
 
I

Istanbul

Guest
Da Bears?

Kavu Titan
Nomadic Elf
Wild Mongrel
Muscle Sliver

There are a ZILLION that are close, but are 2/1. Think 'River Boa'.
 
R

RabidKimba

Guest
Flametongue Kavu > Viashino Warror, from what I understand. Well, except for that time that I played vs U/W Iradecent Angel control, then FTK becomes a bad Viashino.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top