Changes to Mulligan Rule

Discussion in 'CPA/WOTC Magic Issues' started by Melkor, Jun 29, 2015.

  1. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    The fact that you said "made up" furthers my point. Because apparently, the specific words "data collection" in that order means absolutely one thing in your head, while I just happened to use those two words to describe that WOTC gathered information ("collected data") to make their decision/announcement.

    And you continue to bluster and not understandw with the rest.

    Like I said, I'm done.
  2. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    The one you made up?

    It seems like you're trying to get some sort of rise out of me by referring to the contents of my head. This is silly.

    From your wording, perhaps it's worth noting that data collection is a thing. Stringing the two words together creates a reference to a concept that is distinct from either of them separately. So yeah, having those two specific words, in that order, does matter. This has nothing to do with me or my head.

    Huh, it seems like this whole argument could have been avoided if I'd qualified what I'd said about data collection earlier...

    Oh, come on. That line hardly counts...

    Well, maybe twice still isn't enough...

    Three times? Oh well, who reads all these posts anyway?

    So let's make it four, just for the sake of extra super-duper clarity...

    The data that I am claiming has not yet been collected is gameplay detail data on a representative sample of tournament games. This doesn't mean that people don't have any data at all in the universe. I was only talking about that one kind of data, which is why I said as much from the outset, and then said it again three more times. If you want to challenge my emphasis on utility of this kind of data, that's fine (although I'm not sure where you'd go from there now that I've already admitted that even an entirely data-free approach could hypothetically work here). But I think I've been abundantly clear on what kind of data I was talking about.

    I didn't even know that someone could bluster through a keyboard!
  3. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    ?

    Just more falsehoods and incorrect assumptions. Nothing added and nothing's changed, so this is still done.
  4. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

  5. Mooseman Isengar Tussle

    "This came from looking at how frequently players mulliganed to five, and their win percentages."
    Where did they get this information from?
    NOt from match reporting slips at large tournaments (well ones I have been at)
    I have GP Detroit this week, sorry Spidey I will be out Thrusday and Friday), I'll ask about this and see if anyone has any insight.
    This has gone on for way too long into minutia.
  6. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    While he doesn't explicitly state that all of the information they're getting is from in-house testing, he does say...

    Considering that most of what he talks about is dealing with alternative versions of the mulligan, I suspect that most of this is gleaned from in-house testing. There aren't sanctioned tournaments in which these alternative mulligans have been tried, other than the Scry version. He says...

    I haven't had any time to look at PT Magic Origins, so I have no idea what WotC investigated there. Presumably they hoped to learn something, although I don't know if it involved data collection or took some other approach.
  7. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    ""This came from looking at how frequently players mulliganed to five, and their win percentages."

    yes, this and other statement referring to players seemed vague. While I agree with Oversoul that their testing seemed to be in-house, the use of "players" sprinkled through provides a little doubt and wonderment.

    Oversoul, I'm not sure what you mean by your Pro Tour Origins statement. I don't know exactly what or how they collected information, but since they instituted the scry mulligan rule there, that's what they're investigating.
  8. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    I'm bemused that you can purportedly not understand what I've said, then go on to use different words to express the same thing that I'd said.
  9. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

  10. Mooseman Isengar Tussle

    I was told, unofficially, that tapes of pro tour and other events were used as "data". It's definitely not a random sample, but a sample of the games they "care" about. Also, they have a testing group that kept data on games.
    Not sure you two care much anymore, but that's all I got.

    I have failed in my mission, I am not a warrior......
  11. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    I care :) Thanks.

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