Bounce/Blinking Deck

Discussion in 'Casual Decks/Variants/Etc' started by Rakarth, Sep 14, 2008.

  1. Rakarth New Member

    Qasali Ambusher was a late addition after the release of Shards, he just seemed to fit. He's solid, free and gets me bounce even with a single mana open. Best of all he sets off Moir Vig's first ability :)

    I'll look into Treva's Ruins on eBay to see what I can find. As well as the final Equilibrium is there anything that could be removed or replaced by something infinitely better? Do I still need the Phantasms with 4 Equilibriums? Should I go for straight replacement, as in one Drift of Phantasms out for an Equilibrium?
  2. Shabbaman insert avatar here

    Instead of Absolver thrull I'd go with Wickerbough elder or something like that. Or Wispmare. I'm not too keen on Absolver thrull. What about Woodfall primus? High CC, but persist would be great with bounce. And it's a good finisher.

    I wouldn't cut the Drifts. They're great on defense, and additional tutoring is nice as well. You could try to fit in more singletons with CC 3, like... Eternal witness ;)

    Try to pick up a Mystic snake. If you'd be spending money I'd spend it on that.
  3. Rakarth New Member

    The Thrull isn't the best but it's what I had. Wispmare would be better, especially with evoke. i can't bring myself to put Woodfall Primus in, it seems to be too expensive and the Dust Elemental is a 6/6 flyer and the bounce should be taking care of blockers anyway.

    On the subject of persist I do have Twilight Shepherd which was in the original dcek but it's white and 3WWW and so never made the cut, do you think it's worth another shot? How about Angel of Salvation, flash and convoke and the damage prevention are all good but it's still 6WW I've got to pay and I only :)p) get a 5/5 flyer
  4. Shabbaman insert avatar here

    I think the card you're looking for is Harmonic sliver. Green (and white), cheap (costs 3, transmute!), and it also nails artifacts. As for Twilight shepherd, I'm no fan of it. To make good use of it you need to have a lot of creatures on the board. And it costs too much, and it's not green or blue. Persist is a nice ability, but you don't have anything to sacrifice persisters to. But if you want to, take a look at Kitchen finks.

    Angel of Salvation is a nice beater, you could run some convoke if you have some way to generate a bunch of tokens. I doubt the deck needs it though. If you really want to change the deck, run the Reveillark combo. But the deck is highly synergistic as it is, and people don't like infinite combos. If you play it you'll find what cards you like and what cards you don't like. I can imagine the Ashcoat bears and Zealous guardians will come out at some point. These cards are synergistic within the deck, but crap otherwise. Well, not crap, but just not that good. Perhaps more Qasali ambushers or Whitemane lions?

    Some cards you could look for:

    -Mangara of Corondor. Untap, bounce, RFG, reiterate? Costs 3, transmute! Works nice with Karakas.
    -Gilded drake. I just saw one for 4.50 euro in an expensive shop, should be cheaper elsewhere. This card is evil in this deck.
    -Heartwood storyteller. This could be interesting with all the creatures you play. Especially nice in multiplayer. Costs 3, transmute!
    -Mystic snake. Do I have to explain this? ;)
    -Eternal witness. Heh. Costs 3, did you notice that?
    -Gaddock Teeg. Might be out of your budget, but together with the Meddling mage you can hose a lot of decks. Does not cost three though ;) But everything that does cost 3 isn't countered by him.
    -Sunscape battlemage. Costs 3, transmute! And budget.
    -Wall of roots. Mana acceleration is good. And you're going to have problems with really fast decks. That could be a weakness. If it is, I'd run Swords to plowshares or something like Daze. Plus more Eternal witness. Perhaps Qasali ambusher is good enough for the purpose of stopping weenie hordes.
    -Wall of blossoms. Elvish visionary with a big butt.
    -Voidmage husher. Can save you. I'd run 1.
    -Mulldrifter. Carddrawing can't be bad.
    -Plaxmanta. The right colors and a great card.
    -Jotun grunt. Graveyard hate. Or:
    -Loaming shaman. Costs 3, transmute!

    I know I already mentioned some of these, but I'm getting enthousiastic about the deck so I just mentioned them again ;) Anyway, I'm considering to build this (kind of) deck myself. I have a survival deck laying around that I don't really like, I could use that as the basis of this deck. I also have 4 Force of Wills that are collecting dust for quite some time, these could go in as well. I'm not saying that you should run these cards, but they do fit in the deck and I happen to have them. Your deck is fine as it is. It can grow from here.
  5. Rakarth New Member

    Thanks for all the great suggestions :)

    I think Harmonic Sliver has got to go in, 2 of them replacing Nikko-Onna and Absolver Thrull. Green also means tutoring from Momir Vig which can never be a bad thing :p Twilight Shepherd is definately out as I doubt I'll have the creatures in play to justify it and like you said, it costs too much, and it's not green or blue. I think leaving Persist out is the best thing, building a persist deck on it's own is better.

    I like the Angel but I don't think I'm going to need her. I can't generate tokens as it is, and the best way to do it within this framework was Stormfront Riders and a Curio I think which have gone.

    Then you should meet my group :) infinite combos get a round of applause when they go off :D the latest was created by using three Changeling Berserkers and Drowner of Secrets to infintely mill all players. Have a Beserker in play, champion it, then champion that with another. The first comes back championing the third, removing it bringing back the second and around this goes, in between this and stacking it correctly you tap the Berserker to mill an opponent for one :D

    How about a infinte amount of copies of Nucklavee using Turnabout and Heat Shimmer?

    I do have a Reveillark deck using Bitter Ordeal and the Verdant, Enigma and Entropic Eidolons from Ravnica along with Claws of Gix. It can mill them, remove their library from the game, or just make them lose infinite life as well as gain me infinite life :)

    Back to the subject though :p

    I think the Ashcoat Bears will leave at some point but I kinda like Zealous Guardian, but it'll all depend on how they perform. Qasali Ambusher just seems like so much fun, I really like the thinking behind it, as for Whitemane Lion, I may put in more depending on how often I find myself without a gating creature as I much prefer Stonecloaker.

    Glad to see your getting re-enthused about this deck type :) the suggestions are all great and I think any of them could be a great addition. I have Voidmage Husher and nw I come to think of it I can't think why it isn't in. Plaxmanta looks good, shroud for all for UG is great. I think a lot of those above are more one of's that can save me if I draw them or can be tutored for.

    At the moment my biggest worry for the deck is if I get picked on too early. Turn three is the earliest I can get an Equilibrium down without acceleration so the two turns before that I might get battered. I don't think I'm going to be able to get hold of Swords to Plowshares at the moment although I might go for Condemn as a poorer substitute, maybe even Holy Day just as a little bit of protection. I just need to hold them back until my bounce can completely take hold.

    Well then, we'll see what happens from here on in. Let me know how your build is going, maybe a match sometime? That'd be so very interesting :D Thanks for all your help. Rakarth
  6. Rakarth New Member

    Hmmm, everything has flash, some kind of super card you say :D

    Vedalken Orrery

    Dunno if it's too slow though but I might proxy a few and see what happens.
  7. Shabbaman insert avatar here

    Why pay 4 to give cards flash when you're already running a substantial amount of flash? I doubt the deck needs it. Flash is nice if you need to bounce opposing creatures with haste (otherwise you could do it on your own turn) or creatures that die on arrival (like evoke) that you need to bounce while their effect is on the stack. Like Mangara of Corondor. Does the deck really need that?

    Vedalken Orrery is an interesting card, but it's probably best with cards that shouldn't have flash. Sorceries like Balancing act.

    BTW, if you're afraid your deck is too slow, run Wall of roots. Great blocker, provides mana acceleration and you can bounce and replay it when it has too many counters. Or Wall of blossoms. Or simply BoP or mana elves. But 4 Qasali ambushers plus something that ensures a plains and forest in play on turn one is probably best. You know, fetchlands and duals (you only need 1, actually) are an investment that will definately pay off.
  8. Rakarth New Member

    I am slightly concerned about speed. At the moment it's more the not getting an Equilibrium out quick enough, although I think the Transmute from Dirft of Phantasms is enough. I did come across Glimpse of Nature for the deck but it turns out I don't play that many creature spells a turn, I just have a lot of creature spells so I'm going to take out the two in the deck and try and get Wall of Roots.
  9. Shabbaman insert avatar here

  10. Rakarth New Member

    Hmmm, interesting but the main problem I have found witht his deck is it's mana base. Getting the right land is all important so I'm not sure about another non-basic that doesn't produce coloured mana. Especially with Wooded Bastion, Mystic Gate and Reflecting Pool in the deck as they rely on having some sort of coloured mana to begin with.
  11. Shabbaman insert avatar here

    That seems like a valid concern. You could run Winding canyons in place of Vedalken Orrery. More land doesn't hurt.
  12. Rakarth New Member

    I never found a place to put the Orrery in the first place, and I'm still on the look out for a fourth Equilibrium. As soon as I have that then I'll play test like crazy and seee if Winding Canyons is necessary.

    Speaking of playtesting, does anyone want to play against this deck on the forum?

  13. Mooseman Isengar Tussle

    What format is it? What decks are you likely to see in the tourney? I could put together a metagame deck to play against it.... just have to figure out what deck that would be....
  14. Rakarth New Member

    This is the current deck list, so you can see it splashes only a few older cards, while the main deck is probably Kamigawa onwards, except for Equilibrium and Meddling Mage.

    I'm not quite sure what kind of metagame I have around me. It's very varied and the games we play are generally multiplayer so they're not too tuned. They are either combo decks like Storm, Mill, Infinte Nucklavee's :p or they are a combination of slowish aggro with a bit of control thrown in. Any fast aggro tends to kill a single player then gets ganged up on and eliminated next so they went the window quickly.

    Erm...other than that I can't think what to say to help you out. Feel free to bring any deck you have to the table and I'll see what happens :D


    PS the deck list above is not quite complete, it's changed only a little bit, but I've got to have some surprises right? :p
  15. Mooseman Isengar Tussle

    Ugh... I thought this was tourney deck you were working on.... my fault

    Want to play a multi-player chaos game? I think we may be able to scare up 1 or 2 other players, and I have a few MP decks already to play.

    Anyone else want to join?
  16. Rakarth New Member

    Sorry, I didn't realise :) Any deck on here that I ask about is going to be casual. The only tourney's I enter are the releases.

    A chaos game would be good yeh, maybe Spidey if he's up for it now he's back again?
  17. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    Hey, I'll play for sure. :)
  18. Rakarth New Member

    Woooo, anyone else want in?
  19. Rakarth New Member

    Slight update as to this decks progress. It's pretty good. The sight of Equilibrium on the table is daunting to anyone, normally you've got a little time to set up board position, but not now :p

    The one thing I have come up against is CIP creatures that I bounce, specifically the Giants from Lorwyn/Morningtide. Arbiter of Knollridge resets life totals so any damage done by my Dust Elementals is useless. Meddling Mage can keep it off the table but in that case I can't stop burn to my head or Dust Elementals. Another slight pain was the Thundercloud Shaman dealing damage that Plaxmaanta couldn't prevent to all my creatures. It was only 1 damage to all most of the time but that's all it takes for Coiling Oracle, Sage of Epityr and most of my other good utility guys to bite the dust.

    I did lose the game, coming second out of three players, but it was good fun. I need Mystic Snake for solid countering :) Momir Vig is stupendously good, Plaxmanta is great and Stonecloaker is always good. Momentary Blink surprisingly never came into the equation and after adding in Venser I'm thinking about taking him out again as he's too much of an investement at 2UU. I only had 2 islands down and this was fine for Coiling Oracles and Plaxmanta repeatedly but Venser needed both to do anything. He's probably going to go for Mystic Snake.

    The deck is nice to play and when it gets going it's hard to stop although I found that losing both Dust Elementals does really hurt your chances of knocking out more than one player so maybe an investment in an Eternal Witness is in order?

    Anyway, i thought I'd let you know how things went down :D

  20. Shabbaman insert avatar here

    Gilded drake might solve your giant problem. It's probably not easy to get a hold of though.

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