Are we worried?

Discussion in 'CPA/WOTC Magic Issues' started by Killer Joe, Nov 23, 2001.


How do rate "Counterspell"?

I LOVE Counterspell 0 vote(s) 0.0%
I LIKE Counterspell 11 vote(s) 45.8%
I could take it or leave it 9 vote(s) 37.5%
I HATE Counterspell 4 vote(s) 16.7%
  1. Killer Joe Active Member

    Ice Age had "Counterspell"
    Mirage did not
    Tempest had "Counterspell"
    Urza's Saga did not
    Mercadian Masques had "Counterspell"
    Invasion did not
    Odyessy DOES NOT!!!!!

    Are we worried?
    I know the core sets take care of this card but I was just wondering why it wasn't included, I thought it was kind of a cool trend.
  2. Mr_Pestilence Wumpus


    Damned Blue cards have almost made me quit this game several times.
  3. arhar Member

    I love Counterspell almost as much as Andy Stokinger, who promised that if he ever won Magic Invitational, his card would be called something like "Spellcounter", cost UU, and read "Counter target spell" :D
  4. MrXarvox The Prettiest Man Alive

    Counterspell is solid, balanced, simple, strategic.

    When they made tons of variants, it became annoying.
  5. Thallid Ice Cream Man 21sT CeNTuRy sChIZoId MaN

    Oh no! No counterspell in Type II! GASP
  6. Apollo Bird Boy

    I LIKE Counterspell, but I don't LIKE-like it. Like, I sorta like it, , but it's not like I like, really like it. Like, if it asked me out, I think I might like it enough to do it like once, but I don't think I like it enough to get in a real relationship with it. Y'know?
  7. Zero T Katama Silver Shadow Guardian

    Yeah, The problem with getting involved with Counterspell is that it zaps all other spells if they make advances towards ya. Could get annoying.
  8. FoundationOfRancor The Gunslinger

    They have stopped reprinting staples in the expansions, such as disenchant and counterspell.

    Personally, I'm just going to miss all the differernt different flavor text and quotes.

    Dont fear, I'm sure they shall be reprinted in every edition.
  9. Istanbul Sucker MCs call me sire.

    Counterspell will always be around. As blue (usually) gets inferior creatures, countermagic and card-drawing will always be the wheels that make it go.
  10. Killer Joe Active Member

    The 5th Edition counterspell is a dude, an ugly dude.

    The 7th Edition Counterspell is a dude, I think.

    The Ice Age Counterspell is definately datable, if you like muscular women.

    The Tempest Counterspell is a dude.

    MM Counterspell is a chick.

    Now which one would you date Apollo?
  11. Istanbul Sucker MCs call me sire.

    Dibs on the MM Counterspell chick!

    Oh, BABY. Summon me anytime!
  12. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    They don't need them for draft or sealed?
  13. Istanbul Sucker MCs call me sire.

    Not especially. Most expansions have some kind of counterspell variant, so Counterspell itself is redundant.
  14. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    Well, I know for variety's sake and such the various Counterspells are out there, but like the thread says, UU: counter anything. You just cant beat that :)
  15. Istanbul Sucker MCs call me sire.

    Sure I can! R/G with Obliterate, Rage, Blurred Mongoose, and Kavu Chameleon. :)
  16. Zadok001 CPA Founder, Greater Good

    I love Counterspell! I've played it for years! But I've been watching it pretty closely, too. I believe I've started two or three threads on subjects related to "Is Counterspell Too Good?" I believe it IS overpowered, and removing it from the evironment would be a Good Thing(tm).

    Every color has had its time in the sun. Every color has had its day of weakness. Red was nothing in UBC. Black can't fight to save its life in the modern Type 2. Green sucks, now and forever, as Wakefield would have said in his day. White was the abandoned stepchild of IBC.

    But there has never been a format in which Blue has been bad. That's because Blue has the two best "themes" in the game - Counters and card drawing. Card drawing is much like discard, except its not useless if your opponent has an empty hand. In fact, it's almost directly superior to blind discard (i.e., not Duress). Countering is just unbelievable. Any spell, short a few "Can't be countered" spells, shut down for UU. Red and Black can shut down any CREATURE for RB. UU takes out any SPELL, including creatures. Wow.

    Counterspell is TOO GOOD, IMHO. Will it go away? Not very soon. WotC needs a REALLY good excuse to take it away. Dark Ritual was bad, but they had a broken deck they could blame for that. Can't blame Counterspell for being a key part of a broken deck right now.

    I hope it rotates out. We need to see cheap counters, but they need to be conditional. Mana Leak should return.
  17. Istanbul Sucker MCs call me sire.

    Zadok, I truly believe that taking Counterspell away from blue will do a lot towards *crippling* it utterly.

    Black survived the loss because its themes are still intact. Discard, directed creature removal, speed with a's all still there, you just don't get to do it all first turn.

    What does blue have without Counterspell? butt-end of the creature, that's about it, isn't it? If blue loses Counterspell, it'll try to fill in the gaps with more situational counters, but fail. The ability to pay UU and counter a spell IF you have the mana open and IF you have the card in-hand and IF your opponent isn't casting an uncounterable is *crucial* to blue's survival.

    Black didn't get neutered, it got pushed back down to where everybody else is.
    Removing Counterspell would neuter blue.
  18. Istanbul Sucker MCs call me sire. play Devil's Advocate to myself, yes, the ability to stop (almost) anything your opponent tries for UU is pretty amazing. But that's only when you look at the card on its own. If you look at blue as a color, all of its strengths and weaknesses, you suddenly realize *why* Counterspell is blue.
  19. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    to play devil's advocate, you still have the other Counterspell variants. It's like Bolt being reduced to Shock; you can still counter something, just with some "additional" stuff added instead of a blanket no-nonsense counter.
  20. Istanbul Sucker MCs call me sire.

    Ah, but Shock still does what it does. It'll never NOT be able to do 2 damage to something. It'll never sit dead in your hand. Whereas counterspells like Confound, Exclude, and Prohibit will.

    Let's assume you have all three in hand, and you land-drop every turn.

    Turn 1 (your opponent) Forest, Birds.
    Turn 1 (you) Island, go.
    Turn 2 (your opponent) Island, Static Orb.
    Turn 2 (you) Island, go.
    Turn 3 (your opponent) Island, go.
    Turn 3 (you) Island, go.
    Turn 4 (your opponent) Island, Opposition. Let the beatings begin.

    Notice how your counterspells never made a difference?

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