Webcam Magic

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theorgg

Guest
I frequent another forum and on it a few of the forum members are playing Magic via webcam.

If anyone here's interested (these guys are VERY casual, so it should be a good fit), the link to the thread is http://www.littlerubberguys.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=28004.

Should be better than Magic Online, eh? (expecially since it's too hgih-end to be played on older computers, now...)
 
Oversoul

Oversoul

The Tentacled One
This seems like a pretty cool idea. I, of course, lack a webcam (and cards, at the moment, since Al0ysius has them, but unlike me, he's actually building decks with them). Ultimately, it doesn't seem like it would have any advantage over Apprentice or playing over a chatroom, except for the aesthetic appeal. If any CPA members went and did this and recorded it and posted the games somewhere, I would watch them.
 
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Spiderman

Administrator
Staff member
Ultimately, it doesn't seem like it would have any advantage over Apprentice or playing over a chatroom
Click to expand...
I can't tell if the thread gives an example since I can't download anything because I'm not registered, but does the webcam cover the player too or just the playing area? If the former, then at least you get to see your opponent as opposed to being "faceless" via Apprentice or chatroom :)
 
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theorgg

Guest
You can move the camera, though I belive they just hook it to where it can see the play area.
 
Oversoul

Oversoul

The Tentacled One
I would think they'd place the camera over the field of play, like in this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTaWil5gRqk

Placing it at an angle to see the person and the field might annoy some people, as they cannot get a close look at the cards and cannot move the camera themselves as they could move their field of vision if they were actually sitting there. It might just be most practical to go with the overheard thing.
 
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Spiderman

Administrator
Staff member
Can't see the video as it's blocked from work.

It makes sense to just see the cards, just wasn't sure if the technology was there to somehow get both without losing details.
 
Oversoul

Oversoul

The Tentacled One
Haha. Somehow I knew beforehand what your "colorful language" would be. I was expecting a bit more of a lambasting than that, though...
 
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Spiderman

Administrator
Staff member
I actually didn't see any lambasting, if that thread is just one page. Just the kind of reactions you'd get from here (or at least Ransac).

I know studies have been done with a regular deck of 52 cards that 7 riffle shuffles pretty much randomizes it. I can't imagine it would be much more for a 60 card deck - maybe 8, but not as high as 27 :eek:
 
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theorgg

Guest
It's due to the duplication involved in the deck design. Seven is sufficient for a 52 card deck without any duplication. Adding duplication of cards, the requirement is much higher...

Somewhere there's an article about the math behind it, but I don't have time to find it right now. I've got to get something to eat and go to class.
 
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Spiderman

Administrator
Staff member
Hmm. But some cards you don't mind if you get more than once (like land, or 1-low mana drops).

But I probably wouldn't understand the math anyway :)
 
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theorgg

Guest
There's something it deals with called "True Random" that's actually unobtainable by humans, but a high amount of shuffling comes close to it. Like any one card next to a different card, it's a high probability (low 60's, percent wise) of being within 12 cards of each other. However, since that's not too significant in game terms, 27 riffles with a simirandom deck is enough.
 
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train

Guest
The dependence for the math is also based on whether the proportions of the shuffle are true (ie- each time the deck is split - it is exactly 30-30 or 26-26...) and that each card falling onto the opposing card is exactly 1:1... otherwise, the randomness will never attain true random... The mix of the shuffle also has to allow cards to not fall in any particular order - all the time...

However - it has been shown that you can arrange cards in a deck, so that when shuffled in multiple factors (2,3,4,5,6,7, etc.) the cards can land in a specific order, or give you up to a 90% chance that the cards are within 3-4 cards of each other...

I'll present a spreadsheet later on...
 
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train

Guest
I forgot to mention - that during the search and first potential shuffle - the player could again sort the cards into a shuffling order, then shuffle, then be ready for the cut etc.

And though most may say the cut would change what they get first hand - it may - but when the distribution is in such a sequenced manner - most of the time, even after the cut, the draw would suffice.
 
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