F
FoundationOfRancor
Guest
Yes.
M
maraud234
Guest
I agree with FoundationOfRancor
A
arhar
Guest
I never had to ask myself this question. Does this answer it? 
C
Cateran Emperor
Guest
When I start calling people 'scrubs' or 'sticks', the two stupidest descriptions ever, then I want someone to execute me on the spot. That means I'm playing and not having fun doing it.
Killer Joe
New member
And how leading are THESE questions!?
That first one is like the ol' question:
"Hey, do you still beat your wife?"
If 'yes', you're screwed, if 'no', you're screwed.
How about a reconfigurement:
a.) Do you play casually for fun?
b.) Do you play casually to win?
c.) Do you play casually with a mix of playing for fun and winning?
d.) Do you play competetively for fun?
e.) Do you play competetively to win?
f.) Do you play competetively with a mix of playing for fun and winning?
g.) Do you play casually and competetively with a mix of playing for fun and winning?
<I'm in test-mode due to mid-terms>
I choose answer g.)
Also, why play to lose? I think what we're all trying to say is that, "Winning isn't everything." And, you probably don't go into a frothing, heaving, anger state-of-mind when you lose, I know I don't.
That first one is like the ol' question:
"Hey, do you still beat your wife?"
If 'yes', you're screwed, if 'no', you're screwed.
How about a reconfigurement:
a.) Do you play casually for fun?
b.) Do you play casually to win?
c.) Do you play casually with a mix of playing for fun and winning?
d.) Do you play competetively for fun?
e.) Do you play competetively to win?
f.) Do you play competetively with a mix of playing for fun and winning?
g.) Do you play casually and competetively with a mix of playing for fun and winning?
<I'm in test-mode due to mid-terms>
I choose answer g.)
Also, why play to lose? I think what we're all trying to say is that, "Winning isn't everything." And, you probably don't go into a frothing, heaving, anger state-of-mind when you lose, I know I don't.
C
Chaos Turtle
Guest
I was trying to keep it simple!
T
TURD CUTTER!!!
Guest
Magic's no fun anymore. That's why I stopped playing.
I should probly finish my homework so I can get to sleep.
I should probly finish my homework so I can get to sleep.
E
ErinPuff
Guest
Yes, Magic is still fun, for me at least.. I play casually, to have fun. Yes, winning is fun. I can't deny that. But losing can be fun, too. I'd rather lose a game full of interesting stuff and actual thought than win a game on turn 2 without having to think about it.
M
MrClueless
Guest
Magic is fun if you don't play it every single day or for hours at a time. I don't play magic very much anymore, but before, I played magic casually for fun.
D
DÛke
Guest
...really plays to win.
How could you tolerate something you dislike for so long?
Suppose I have a job...one that pays me hella money. I happen to hate the job, but I'll be workin' my a#@ off.
I hate the freakin' job dang it!
Suppose I have a game...one that gives me halla money if I win. I happen to hate the game, but I'll be playin' my a@# off.
I hate the freakin' game dang it!
It doesn't matter if you play to win or not. If you're not having fun, obviously, you'll not continue to play. There's a certain satisfaction that comes ONLY from building a deck. Those people who sit and MAKE up the decks, like Gizmo, they have fun. Sure, they like to win, and sure they MIGHT (again, MIGHT) not adore casual gaming, but still...they adore somethin' about the game.
There's NO ONE that plays Magic that doesn't enjoy it.
There's NOTHING that is so powerful, thus being able to bind someone to something simply for the money.
If you play Magic, you have fun...wheather you like it or not...or else, you wouldn't be playing.
How could you tolerate something you dislike for so long?
Suppose I have a job...one that pays me hella money. I happen to hate the job, but I'll be workin' my a#@ off.
I hate the freakin' job dang it!
Suppose I have a game...one that gives me halla money if I win. I happen to hate the game, but I'll be playin' my a@# off.
I hate the freakin' game dang it!
It doesn't matter if you play to win or not. If you're not having fun, obviously, you'll not continue to play. There's a certain satisfaction that comes ONLY from building a deck. Those people who sit and MAKE up the decks, like Gizmo, they have fun. Sure, they like to win, and sure they MIGHT (again, MIGHT) not adore casual gaming, but still...they adore somethin' about the game.
There's NO ONE that plays Magic that doesn't enjoy it.
There's NOTHING that is so powerful, thus being able to bind someone to something simply for the money.
If you play Magic, you have fun...wheather you like it or not...or else, you wouldn't be playing.
H
Hetemti
Guest
Magic is becoming less fun for me every day.
I've built a deck for every color, bichrome combination, and all tricolor save WUB, and I'm out of ideas.
I love R/W. I can't build another R/W deck. I tried. It started to evolve in the same pattern as my other R/W deck. I don't need two! Same goes for my G/U deck. It starts different, but comes to the same "end." It's the same deck I dismantled before. That bores me.
When I do build a decent deck, I test it against my other decks, since noöne locally plays. Guess what.
If the new deck loses, I wasted two hours.
If the new deck wins, why did I keep that pile of s' that was the other deck?
I'm a loser either way.
Improve the losing deck, perhaps? Not on my bank account. $3.50 for 14 random pieces of crap /w a 30% chance of a usable rare. Singles? Lets say I get a deal: $1.00 for the card. Plus the MO. Plus the shipping. That's $2.09 right there. Cost just doubled. Now add two hours going to and waiting at the Post Orifice, two weeks for the letter to get there, two weeks for it to get back, contacting the guy that it didn't come, recieve the "Oh! I didn't know it was YOU" bit, two more weeks (totaling six), and I have a card for a deck I sent through the shredder auld lang syne. Wanna trade? It'll still be six weeks, but it'll take forever to find a trader because there are three kinds to deal with:
1) I sink billions into T2! Me gusta Scuta! I can't be without Chant! Can't have Rector, want Doomsday Specter!
ME: Looking for (Insert random crappy rares I want for no reason.)
Mr.T2: How many Scutas, Chants, and Specters ya got?
ME: Uh...2, 1, and 1.
Mr.T2: Gemme those four for my four (whatever.)
ME: You play T2?
Mr.T2: DUH! I'm l33t! St4nd4rd r0xorz j00!
ME: Since what I want is worth eight bucks, and the four you want are around eight each, I don't think that's a fair trade...I have other T2 legal stuff...
Mr.T2: NOT INTERESTED >click<
2) I'm the Extended/T1 player. Any game that took longer to play than it did to shuffle took too long...
ME: Looking for (Insert random crappy rares I want for no reason.)
Mr.T1: I wan't Morphling.
ME: Mine aren't for trade.
Mr.T1: Lotus? Moxen? P10?
ME: I've none.
Mr.T1: NOT INTERESTED >click<
3) I'm the collector. I want one of every card printed.
ME: Looking for (Insert random crappy rares I want for no reason.)
Mr.C: I want a pink Piety!
ME: What?
Mr.C: There is a superduperultrarare misprint in 4th edition where the card Piety was printed with a pink/red hue.
ME: Yeah. I've got one.
Mr.C: I'll give you whatever cards you want for it. Name your price!
ME: Lets see, I need...
Mr.C: The Piety is in perfect mint condition, right?
ME: Guess so...
Mr.C: GUESS?! What do you mean?!
ME: Well, I took it out of the booster and put it in my card box...
Mr.C: Whoa, did you touch, breath upon, or look at it in any way?
ME: Well...I touched it when I pulled it from the booster and put it in the box...and to have known it was pink I had to have looked at it...
Mr.C: ...and by the very act of doing so, reduced it's value! GOOD. BYE! >click<
Yep. Tradin's the way to go.
BTW: Can anyone confirm the rarity of the Pink Piety? I saw it on eBay going for $15. Is it really valuble, or was the Turkish guy (I KISS YOU!) just scammin'? I do have one...
I've built a deck for every color, bichrome combination, and all tricolor save WUB, and I'm out of ideas.
I love R/W. I can't build another R/W deck. I tried. It started to evolve in the same pattern as my other R/W deck. I don't need two! Same goes for my G/U deck. It starts different, but comes to the same "end." It's the same deck I dismantled before. That bores me.
When I do build a decent deck, I test it against my other decks, since noöne locally plays. Guess what.
If the new deck loses, I wasted two hours.
If the new deck wins, why did I keep that pile of s' that was the other deck?
I'm a loser either way.
Improve the losing deck, perhaps? Not on my bank account. $3.50 for 14 random pieces of crap /w a 30% chance of a usable rare. Singles? Lets say I get a deal: $1.00 for the card. Plus the MO. Plus the shipping. That's $2.09 right there. Cost just doubled. Now add two hours going to and waiting at the Post Orifice, two weeks for the letter to get there, two weeks for it to get back, contacting the guy that it didn't come, recieve the "Oh! I didn't know it was YOU" bit, two more weeks (totaling six), and I have a card for a deck I sent through the shredder auld lang syne. Wanna trade? It'll still be six weeks, but it'll take forever to find a trader because there are three kinds to deal with:
1) I sink billions into T2! Me gusta Scuta! I can't be without Chant! Can't have Rector, want Doomsday Specter!
ME: Looking for (Insert random crappy rares I want for no reason.)
Mr.T2: How many Scutas, Chants, and Specters ya got?
ME: Uh...2, 1, and 1.
Mr.T2: Gemme those four for my four (whatever.)
ME: You play T2?
Mr.T2: DUH! I'm l33t! St4nd4rd r0xorz j00!
ME: Since what I want is worth eight bucks, and the four you want are around eight each, I don't think that's a fair trade...I have other T2 legal stuff...
Mr.T2: NOT INTERESTED >click<
2) I'm the Extended/T1 player. Any game that took longer to play than it did to shuffle took too long...
ME: Looking for (Insert random crappy rares I want for no reason.)
Mr.T1: I wan't Morphling.
ME: Mine aren't for trade.
Mr.T1: Lotus? Moxen? P10?
ME: I've none.
Mr.T1: NOT INTERESTED >click<
3) I'm the collector. I want one of every card printed.
ME: Looking for (Insert random crappy rares I want for no reason.)
Mr.C: I want a pink Piety!
ME: What?
Mr.C: There is a superduperultrarare misprint in 4th edition where the card Piety was printed with a pink/red hue.
ME: Yeah. I've got one.
Mr.C: I'll give you whatever cards you want for it. Name your price!
ME: Lets see, I need...
Mr.C: The Piety is in perfect mint condition, right?
ME: Guess so...
Mr.C: GUESS?! What do you mean?!
ME: Well, I took it out of the booster and put it in my card box...
Mr.C: Whoa, did you touch, breath upon, or look at it in any way?
ME: Well...I touched it when I pulled it from the booster and put it in the box...and to have known it was pink I had to have looked at it...
Mr.C: ...and by the very act of doing so, reduced it's value! GOOD. BYE! >click<
Yep. Tradin's the way to go.
BTW: Can anyone confirm the rarity of the Pink Piety? I saw it on eBay going for $15. Is it really valuble, or was the Turkish guy (I KISS YOU!) just scammin'? I do have one...
I slightly disagree with DUke's analysis...
a job is different in that usually, it's something you HAVE to do and in post-college, it's slightly harder to find one that pays all the bills.
Magic, you don't have to do it. So if you don't have fun, sure, you might quit. But if you're in the tourney scene, you might be building a deck that needs to WIN, but not one that necessarily is "fun" for you to play. I think Finkel did that a couple times, he played a deck style that really wasn't "him", but was what he considered the "best" for that field. And sure, winning is "fun", but there can be only ONE true winner in a tourney - how many are you going to go to before you get that win? For some, it's a lot... so they might not be having "fun" while playing and losing, all the while looking for that win and "fun"...
Did that make sense? The point is I think there are people who play Magic and don't have the overall sense of "fun" that is referred to as the point of this thread.
a job is different in that usually, it's something you HAVE to do and in post-college, it's slightly harder to find one that pays all the bills.
Magic, you don't have to do it. So if you don't have fun, sure, you might quit. But if you're in the tourney scene, you might be building a deck that needs to WIN, but not one that necessarily is "fun" for you to play. I think Finkel did that a couple times, he played a deck style that really wasn't "him", but was what he considered the "best" for that field. And sure, winning is "fun", but there can be only ONE true winner in a tourney - how many are you going to go to before you get that win? For some, it's a lot... so they might not be having "fun" while playing and losing, all the while looking for that win and "fun"...
Did that make sense?
The point is I think there are people who play Magic and don't have the overall sense of "fun" that is referred to as the point of this thread.
D
DÛke
Guest
...how might anyone know that Finkel doesn't have fun? Did he say it in an interview or something - "I'm not having fun, I'm just playing to win"? I missed it.
...and what is his "style"?
I mean, I'm not trying to say you're not right, Spiderman, you may be...but people change. What's MY style, I ask myself, and I see that it changes. From a huge U/B fan, into B/R (and I don't even LIKE Red). Then, one day, I suddenly decided that Green was my thing...so I picked up B/G. Another day, Black didn't seem so hot, so U/G came into mind. See? It's not that hard to change one's style.
...besides, wouldn't YOU, Spidey, ENJOY gaining all that money...wouldn't that be fun? Everyone loves money, and doin' something to earning it IS fun...not to mention, the deckbuilding that comes a long with it, selecting precise cards, and even perfecting a deck to the point of disgust.
All these aspects could be proven fun to one person, but rather slow, exhausting material to another.
...After all, not all "fun" is legal...some do it anyway.
...and what is his "style"?
I mean, I'm not trying to say you're not right, Spiderman, you may be...but people change. What's MY style, I ask myself, and I see that it changes. From a huge U/B fan, into B/R (and I don't even LIKE Red). Then, one day, I suddenly decided that Green was my thing...so I picked up B/G. Another day, Black didn't seem so hot, so U/G came into mind. See? It's not that hard to change one's style.
...besides, wouldn't YOU, Spidey, ENJOY gaining all that money...wouldn't that be fun? Everyone loves money, and doin' something to earning it IS fun...not to mention, the deckbuilding that comes a long with it, selecting precise cards, and even perfecting a deck to the point of disgust.
All these aspects could be proven fun to one person, but rather slow, exhausting material to another.
...After all, not all "fun" is legal...some do it anyway.
You must have missed it then.
From what I remember, it was a Pro Tour in Europe, probably in '99 (Italy?). I think his style up to then was control and he played a combo (Academy?) deck, but it was a mix like that (control to beatdown, beatdown to combo, whatever). It's on the Dojo somewhere.
Sure, winning the money is fun. That's not what I said. What I said was that the ROAD to winning the money can be long and arduous and probably isn't fun along the way.
This is for some people; I am certainly not speaking for the majority or professing any knowledge to the numbers. But your statement two posts back DID seem to be a blanket "you're playing Magic, you must be having fun, otherwise why play?" and I am merely stating that I think that's untrue.
From what I remember, it was a Pro Tour in Europe, probably in '99 (Italy?). I think his style up to then was control and he played a combo (Academy?) deck, but it was a mix like that (control to beatdown, beatdown to combo, whatever). It's on the Dojo somewhere.
Sure, winning the money is fun. That's not what I said. What I said was that the ROAD to winning the money can be long and arduous and probably isn't fun along the way.
This is for some people; I am certainly not speaking for the majority or professing any knowledge to the numbers. But your statement two posts back DID seem to be a blanket "you're playing Magic, you must be having fun, otherwise why play?" and I am merely stating that I think that's untrue.
D
DÛke
Guest
...the misstated statement then, shall I?
"If you're playing Magic, you must be having fun one way or another, in some aspect, otherwise why play?"
...There ya go.
"If you're playing Magic, you must be having fun one way or another, in some aspect, otherwise why play?"
...There ya go.
That's better, but I still think it's possible for someone to play Magic by rote. Just going through the motions on the off-chance he/she might find "fun" (some new twist or something that they haven't seen before). It would seem pointless for someone to do that, but people do pointless things...
D
DÛke
Guest
...Spiderman, everything is possible these days.
Seriously though, how many people actually play just for pure winning...not even enjoying the aspect of winning, just winning...to show they're better or somethin' similar.
I doubt many (if any) exist.
I think most people, if they don't enjoy anything about the game, then they enjoy, at least, winning.
If they don't enjoy the game, the deckbuilding, the collecting, the art, the community, and not even winning, then, seriously, why would they play?
There MUST be a certain satisfaction. That satisfaction is their "fun"...whatever it may be...
It's like, what's boring for me is someone else's fun...
Seriously though, how many people actually play just for pure winning...not even enjoying the aspect of winning, just winning...to show they're better or somethin' similar.
I doubt many (if any) exist.
I think most people, if they don't enjoy anything about the game, then they enjoy, at least, winning.
If they don't enjoy the game, the deckbuilding, the collecting, the art, the community, and not even winning, then, seriously, why would they play?
There MUST be a certain satisfaction. That satisfaction is their "fun"...whatever it may be...
It's like, what's boring for me is someone else's fun...
F
FoundationOfRancor
Guest
I agree with Duke's point, but he's arguing a very vauge one.
Sure, theres some degree of fun, but the question is, has that fun remained the same as it once was? Are we really enjoying the game as much as we used to, or are we simply clinging to it with grim determination screaming, "Its still good! Its still good!" ?
THAT is the question we have to ask ourselves.
I still enjoy the game. Just like each cycle rotates out and a new one eventually takes its place, there were advantages to playing the game then, and now the've been replaced with new ones.
...Im pretty positive its been all that weed I've been smoking though.
Sure, theres some degree of fun, but the question is, has that fun remained the same as it once was? Are we really enjoying the game as much as we used to, or are we simply clinging to it with grim determination screaming, "Its still good! Its still good!" ?
THAT is the question we have to ask ourselves.
I still enjoy the game. Just like each cycle rotates out and a new one eventually takes its place, there were advantages to playing the game then, and now the've been replaced with new ones.
...Im pretty positive its been all that weed I've been smoking though.
DUke:
All I'm trying to say/add to the second paragraph is that the ROAD to winning may not be fun. For some people, the win is the thing and they don't have fun until they win. THAT'S why they play.
But FoR pretty much brought back the question: Is Magic still fun the way YOU remember it? When you first started? I think we drifted from that and started talking too generally
I agree that winning is one of the nest parts; I think I said that.
All I'm trying to say/add to the second paragraph is that the ROAD to winning may not be fun. For some people, the win is the thing and they don't have fun until they win. THAT'S why they play.
But FoR pretty much brought back the question: Is Magic still fun the way YOU remember it? When you first started? I think we drifted from that and started talking too generally
D
DÛke
Guest
...to answer the question which may have already been answered:
"It depends..."
Before I make it more clear,
I think Magic could be fun, or not. It really depends on the environment you live in, but generally speaking, yes, Magic is still fun - why, you ask? Because nothing really changed.
Sure, more and more people are percieving Magic as a "job" now, and like mentioned, look at the winning as being the ONLY fun aspect...but, more and more people are coming into the game, which is balancing out the situation. I've seen and heard of people ENJOYING the aspect of teaching the game to a new player - ask Zadok.
If you have friends who like to play casual games, then you're alright. Would you really care about the way in which others obtain their "fun"? I wouldn't think so...
...it's when you have no one to play with the kind of games you like...that's when you start lookin' at other situations that you were not able to "see" when you were having YOUR fun.
The game doesn't change, but it is us and our environment that is changing.
Magic has always, and will forever be fun...provided that you know the right people...which ALL comes to living in the right place.
Just because, I am, for example, not having fun playing Magic, and I quit, doesn't mean the game is bad. Not at all. It means that I somehow managed to change my perspective of the game, or something critical has happened to me and/or my environment.
Magic will always be fun.
"It depends..."
Before I make it more clear,
...and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. If that's how they'll obtain their satisfaction, than that's how they'll do it.
I think Magic could be fun, or not. It really depends on the environment you live in, but generally speaking, yes, Magic is still fun - why, you ask? Because nothing really changed.
Sure, more and more people are percieving Magic as a "job" now, and like mentioned, look at the winning as being the ONLY fun aspect...but, more and more people are coming into the game, which is balancing out the situation. I've seen and heard of people ENJOYING the aspect of teaching the game to a new player - ask Zadok.
If you have friends who like to play casual games, then you're alright. Would you really care about the way in which others obtain their "fun"? I wouldn't think so...
...it's when you have no one to play with the kind of games you like...that's when you start lookin' at other situations that you were not able to "see" when you were having YOUR fun.
The game doesn't change, but it is us and our environment that is changing.
Magic has always, and will forever be fun...provided that you know the right people...which ALL comes to living in the right place.
Just because, I am, for example, not having fun playing Magic, and I quit, doesn't mean the game is bad. Not at all. It means that I somehow managed to change my perspective of the game, or something critical has happened to me and/or my environment.
Magic will always be fun.