RE: The format change...should we...

[Thallid Ice Cream Man]

Originally posted by Gizmo
Casting a wider net just means leaving bigger holes.

Especially if there are only about 15 people working on sewing the net back together.

I have officially changed my mind.

Having a general gaming site is a nice concept, but we'd have trouble finding prospective members. In the videogame community, for example, the term "casual players," if used at all, means something on the order of "person who plays sports games/fps for 2 hrs. a week" -- not the sort of person we'd want to attract, or who would be attracted here.
In the meantime, each person here might submit 3 or 4 articles that have little to do with each other, and then stop.

Besides, most of my thoughts about games and gaming are best suited to a "discussion" format, so while I've gamed a lot I probably wouldn't submit any thoughtful articles -- just forum topics.

I want to make a stand now against the "general gaming" concept, not because I would necessarily leave if the site were converted, but because this is the only way I might get it to stay but with more members. I'll still stay here either way, but I'd prefer Magic only.

I agree with the call for change, but I now disagree with the method advocated by Rando. I just don't think it will work.

 

[Elrond]

I have to say that I agree with most of Gizmo's points. The only one I don't like is the STPA, and that's because I am not a struggling tournament player, the only tournaments I attend are prereleases.

I think either route the site takes would be good, because either way I'll be here, admittedly it'll probably be as a semi-active lurker, but still I'll be here as long as this site exists.

 

[Gizmo]

Im not suggesting an abandonment of the CPA in favour of the STPA, but that the CPA should be ready to accept people who are really STPA members, even though the STPA is really just a figment of my imagination.

If the CPA opened it`s arms to everyone struggling to make it as a tourney player, and promises not to just dismiss them or their rogue decks as scrubby, then you`ll become a more attractive site.

 

[Rando]

As long as I'm not considered "the guy that almost killed the CPA", then I'm cool with anything that may invigorate this site.

As I consider myself serious Magic player, I am willing to do whatever is asked of me to help out with our "renisance".

Don't hate me because I care. I was in all seriousness trying to help.

 

[Istanbul]

Originally posted by Gizmo
Those players are trying to get Brainburst to set up a forum specially for rogue decks.

Er, uh...isn't that sort of like stabbing yourself repeatedly so that you won't die?

 

[rkoelsch]

Originally posted by Gizmo
And people dont feel like they fit in because they are slapped instantly if they get out of line. There no real tolerance of newbies.

Most of your ideas sound good and I am glad that things are being discussed to improve this site. But this statement seems a tad hypocritical. Back when there was more Magic talk and you were playing, your suggestions were often rude. I do not question your ability, you have progressed farther than I have but you had little patience for people who used substandard cards.

 

[Istanbul]

Time for me to weigh in with my viewpoint.

If the CPA has been dying, changing it away from Magic will be the final nail in the coffin.

The CPA has been my 'Home' page for a long time...years...for several reasons. One is because I think about Magic probably way too much for a person of my age. Another is because it's one of the only places that isn't absolutely beset by netdecking fiends and insult-slinging jerks who belittle you endlessly if you think about doing something that isn't 'the latest tech'. (There is one noteable exception, but he knows who he is.)

Do I like Monopoly? Heck yes! Do I think about it as much as I think about Magic? Are you kidding? None of the other game formats has as much pull as Magic.

As much as I dislike Gizmo personally, I realize that occasionally he does have some valid points, and this would be one of them. What this site needs isn't a change away from Magic, it needs a change TOWARDS Magic. I, for one, am willing to promise to write one article per week (I'll try to make it good, but I have to admit, I'm not the best at what I do or even close), and will add the CPA to my signature on every board I'm on, as well as plugging it everywhere that will let me. I believe that we need to stifle these flamewars that spring up every five minutes, to the point where I'm ready to START CLOSING THREADS if given the go-ahead to do so.

The CPA needs to be what it is. The Casual Players' Alliance, a web site where you can go to talk about Magic even if you aren't rabidly drooling over the latest 'tech'. A breath of fresh air from the cutthroat, netdeck environment that has sprung up...a place where you can post your latest bizarre deck idea and instead of being told 'that's a stupid idea, give it up', get actual helpful deck advice on how to make it better without making it not yours anymore.

I've enjoyed the CPA for years. Time for me to start giving back. Just don't turn it into the GGA (Generic Games Alliance).

 

[osmwt]

From what I have read, the wheels are already in motion to bring about some change. I've only been here a short time, but for me, the 'campy' atmosphere and casual orientation are the sites' main appeals. Magic is a game, like any other that provides a diversion for all of us. I would welcome an oppurtunity to be exposed to the diversions that interest other gamers. That said, I came here because it was a Magic site and I haven't found another game that is as diverting as Magic. I think a broader perspective for the CPA would be a good thing, but I don't think that perspective should come at the expense of personality. How about The Casual Gamers Alliance?

 

[TomB]

You guys never cease to amaze me...

Very well then, as far as I'm concerned we can keep the front page Magic only. I mean, since it sounds like you're all volunteering to write quality front page articles, and to do what it takes to promote the site out there in "other Magic site-land", and to keep the forums all spritzed up and fresh with new threads and decks ideas and such, there's really no need to expand our focus here in an effort to liven things up.

And that's a good thing, because Isty is probably right - once we expand ourselves to include non-Magic articles, and non-Magic talk, Magic itself on the site would possibly die. It's actually been in it's death throes for a while now here, in case you all hadn't noticed, but this could very well push it over the edge.

Who's fault is that? I mean, who exactly is responsible for the lack of Magic talk around here? Has there been top quality Magic orientated articles submitted for the Front page that were ignored? Deleted somehow? And is there someone running around deleting all the Magic orientated threads in the forums?

Just who is this madman...

Sigh.

There is no such madman. No one has been working to suppress Magic talk in this place - this is a Magic website - yet no one here lately has wanted to talk about the game, and not many of you here have ever written Front page quality material and submitted it for publication here. You all want to talk about how much you see this place as dying, yet very few of you are willing to make the commitment to keeping it alive.

So I guess we'll see what happens. If you all follow through on what you appear to be saying here, then there'll be no need to expand things since there'll be plenty of Magic articles, and plenty of Magic talk in the forums...

On the other hand, maybe not...

 

[Spiderman]

Man, I gotta agree with TomB... personally, I will support any move we make that is decided to go either way, but all of the "pro-Magic" people's comments just make me laugh...

To reiterate TomB's point: WHERE THE HECK ARE YOU ON THE FORUMS IF YOU'RE JUST INTERESTED IN MAGIC? I am on here every weekday except every other Friday, and I can tell you people who aren't on as regularly that there is NO Magic talk and hasn't been for a good four months. Mr. P, Duel, Gizmo, TICM, Elrond... are you guys too busy playing Magic than to come here? That's understandable, but it doesn't help the site. Gizmo, you've been here off and on (more on) and you have some great ideas, but do you need an "okay" or something to go ahead with them? Are you just giving them out so others can take it up? Isty and rkoelsch have been here doing Magic stuff, but as less people reply/talk about stuff, they do likewise (no fault of their own, I'm not blaming them).

In fact, I'm not blaming anyone, I'm just asking: Where are you guys? If you want this place to live as Magic only, you've got to contribute too. That's basically the point.

Duel:

Look at Beyond Dominaria. They cater almost exclusively to Type 1 players....

And if you've noticed, they've shut down (at least for new content). Talk to rakso for the details... they live on in one of StarCity's forums, I believe.

 

[Rando]

I think I'll just drum my fingers and wait.

Ho hum...

 

[Gizmo]

Well... if there is a commitment to article writing, and an agreement to do this, then lets start organising... site changes, things like that.

I`ll write an article a week, I can handle that. If you want I`ll edit the front page... I can handle that too, I think... its more a case of whether people can handle me editting their articles.

Lets get the graphics makeover sorted.

Lets streamline these forums... too many different areas makes the site baffling to newcomers. I`d kill the New Members bit, combine two of the top three forums into just two - it feels like there is a lot of overlap there. Single Card Strategy and Deckbuilding... I`d put them together as well I think because dividing user attention is never good.

I stopped posting in the deck strategy section because it was obvious nobody wanted me there.

 

[Elrond]

Spidey: I've been too busy with college work, especially studying for finals, to play magic lately. Hopefully I'll be able to get out and play some physical magic this summer.

 

[Thallid Ice Cream Man]

My Magic playing has also slowed down, also because of work, although I'm only at high school. It's a demanding high school. I hope to be more involved in Magic during the summer and next year though.

On a slightly related topic, I am still making up Magic cards, and in fact I'm slowly making a set, so let's not close the Home-Made Cards section in the update -- at least not immediately.

And to be perfectly frank, I've never written a Magic strategy article because the only magic articles I ever wrote were from 2 years ago and were utter crap. I might write about the "creative" process (you'd have to suspend disbelief that I'm unqualified, though, even though I probably am) of rogue decks or something.

 

[TomB]

Allow me to reiterate, and to clarify - I don't really think there's anything wrong here that more Magic-orientated participation won't fix. If you wish to see the place remain a place for Magic only, writing regular articles and participating in Magic talk in the forums would be the way to do it.

As far as your other suggestions go, Gizmo, while we appreciate your offer to edit the Front page that's Spidey's baby for now, so we're okay there. We are currently discussing a forum re-arrangement in the FF, and I expect there to be some news there soon. In fact, I'd say the main reason changes haven't yet appeared is because we weren't sure how this format change issue would turn out. Now that this is settled (?) we can get on with the realignment.

And, ummm...if you wish to have some input into changes to our graphics please let Mike know your thoughts via PM's, or email. He would definitely be the one to talk to about anything technical on the site.

I really hope you guys are serious about revitalizing Magic here. We'll see how it all turns out...

 

[Spiderman]

Well, I think I could handle front page stuff right now if a couple of articles come in once a week, but if it turns into a flood where the front page needs updating every day (which is hopefully a goal), I will be sure to ask for help

 

[DÛke]

...

Spiderman:

...but if it turns into a flood...

That'll never happen. Not in the next 6 or so months anyway. We just don't have that many writers...

 

[Spiderman]

Probably not, but I'm just saying that I would be open to help at that point

 

[Gizmo]

I wouldnt ever aim to update daily. I dont think you`ll ever achieve that. I`d look to regular weekly updates of 3-4 articles.

 

[TomB]

or weakly...

I thought the idea here was to at least target daily updates. I mean, isn't the idea to update daily so your readership needs to check in daily so as not to miss anything? Don't get me wrong - I think updating with 3 or 4 quality articles a week would be a tremendous improvement over where we are right now, but I actually think it would be better to spread those out over 2 or 3 updates during the week, thus keeping the Front page a bit more active.

Just a thought...