old idea with new cards

[immortal grave walker]

This idea as already been played, however this is a differnt style deck.
4-Llanowar elves
4-birds of paradise
4-plow under
4-animate land
2-multani, maro-sorcerer
1-natural affinty
1-hurricane

4-dark ritual
4-eradicate
4-rain of tears
2-chimeric idol
3-tangle wire
3-v.tutor

3-gaeas cradle
7-forest
10-swamps

This is a basic deck of turning your opponants land into a creature then eradicate the lands out of thier hand,library and graveyard then allowing them to play nothing hopefully. On a good draw this deck can work on turn 2. example( first turn you play a forest,done. they play a land then what ever if anything. Then you play end of urn effects turning thier land into an animate land. your turn play a swamp,dark ritual, eradicate. Any ideas on improving the deck feel free to say. multani is basicly the kill card also a beat down with elves.

 

[Mikeymike]

Even with elves, 20 lands is dangerously low. But besides that, I would run at least 2 cities of brass to increase your chances of getting that critical green mana. Also, with all the LD and the Tangle Wires, I don't know how useful the mana intensive Plow Unders will be. Granted they work very nicely w/ the Animate/Eradicate combo, buts thats a ton of mana your putting into the combo.

Also, Thorn Elemental will probably serve as a better kill card b/c if they do have any mana out its possible for them to drop chump blockers for awhile.

Jolreal would be very dangerous in here also.

One last thing, despoil might be better in here than the rain of tears. Even though its 1 more to cast, its much more dual color friendly, and it damages them directly.

Just some thoughts, hope it helps.

 

[immortal grave walker]

Ihis is my first shot at a deck like this. with the t.wire out it slows my opponant and helps me if i have some elves and birds out. The reason i dint go with thorny is he can be targeted, multani cant plus if my opponant cant cast anything multani will be a 7/7 plus the cards in my hand and he cant be targeted. The mana thing might have to be redone. also the despoil might be bettter, then again it slows my mana, the city I willl add after you have mentioned it. thanks for your input more is welcom.

 

[Mikeymike]

The only card thats really played that will kill a Thorn and not Multani is Snuff Out. Vendetta would hit them for seven, Exile rarely gets used, and red burn won't cut the mustard. Although blue bounce could pose a slight problem. I'd say try both out.

Also, how have the Plow Unders been working for you?

 

[immortal grave walker]

the plows been pretty good if you get them early cause that gives me time to set up. thats when the tutors come in handy. Since im kinda mana heavy i thought about snake basket for blockers and maybe more beat down. nothing like loosing to a bunch of 1/1's im just trying to think of another way to win if you cant get the combo.

 

[Mikeymike]

Instead of Snake Baskets, run Hermits.
Snake Basket costs you 4 to cast and another X for X critters.
Hermit costs 5 for 5. Pay the upkeep and they are 2/2's or don't pay anything and he's cheaper overall then the Snake Basket. Unless you think you can pop a 12 point Basket w/ regularity, go with the Hermit.

If you can find her, I would seriously consider Jolreal. Say you get her out on Turn 4. Turn 5, leave 3 mana open, done. During your opponent's end phase use her ability, all of YOUR lands (not his) are 3/3's until EOT.

I have a Natural Affinity/Massacre deck I just built for multiplayer. The deck isn't that consistent, but its extremely potent. I got to play it once last week and Jolreal won the game for me. I'm at two life and being picked on by two players late in the game, Jolreal allowed me to attack for 28 points and kill the 2 people teaming me. She put the fear of God in everyone at that table (mostly b/c I was running Exploration, Horn of Greed and yav. Elder too so I was at a serious land advantage). Its a fun deck, if you want the list let me know.

 

[Y The Alien]

Tag Guard

Doesn't she say "until end of turn"? There's no way to keep the lands from reverting if she says that. So your neat little trick doesn't work.

 

[Mikeymike]

Same principle as the Waylay incident. At the end of the turn (EOT), all EOT effects clear. However, you can now play any fast effects and/or instants with effects that last until the EOT and they last until the end of your turn b/c your opponents EOT has come and gone. I hope I'm right, b/c not only will I feel like a dips**t but I talked it over on email w/ a L2 judge and he told me it worked.

Just so I know for sure (b/c I might have to change my deck which would suck) I'm sending wizards a rules Q about it.

 

[Apollo]

Just a note:

Your second-turn scenario doesn't work as you would have no mana with which to play the Animate Land. Jolrael would be good. Watch out though: if they get enough land out before you do this trick, you will be helping them by removing lands they don't need from their deck, making them more likely to draw useful cards. Do it early or not at all.

Apollo

 

[immortal grave walker]

first turn i play a forest, done. my opponant plays a land hes done I play between turn effects animatig his land. My turn his land is still a 3/3 i play a swamp,dark ritual,eradicate.

 

[Zadok001]

"Between turn effects?" I think not... The deal with Waylay is slightly different than what's being described here. See, the key factor that allowed Waylay to work (pathetic rules issue, beginning NOW) is that Waylay said 'AT end of turn.' 'Until end of turn' effects are cleared away during Cleanup, during which no effects can be played. And, if anything important happens during Cleanup, Cleanup restarts. So, since Animate Land says 'until end of turn,' you can't make it work like Waylay for two turns.

Mikeymike, the only thing you missed was this: At the EOT, all _at_ EOT effects trigger. Then you can put more effects on the stack, seeing as they won't trigger their at EOT effects until the _next_ EOT. The other EOT effects ("until"s) don't trigger at all, they simply happen, and they don't happen until Cleanup.

So, to sum this up, no, you may not use Animate Land over the course of two turns. Ditto for Jorael.

"Damn stupid rule, IMHO, but a rule nonetheless."

 

[Y The Alien]

Tag Guard

There is a HUGE difference between "AT end of turn", and "until end of turn", that difference being there is ZERO way to get an "until end of turn" effect to last beyond one turn.


"Really, R&D isn't THAT stupid..."
"Well, they printed Time Spiral...."

 

[arhar]

Turn 1: Forest, Elf
Turn 2: Swamp, Ritual, Animate, Eradicate

 

[Apollo]

That works, but the scenario he presented didn't work. We are very picky people.

Apollo

 

[immortal grave walker]

so your saying before I declare my untap phase I cant play animate land,and animate my opponants land,and that land be a 3/3 creature after my untap phase?

 

[Spiderman]

Well, technically you can't cast ANY spells in between your opponent's turn and your turn (a literal interpretation of "before my untap step") but if you mean during the End Phase of your opponent's turn,

No, you cannot cast Animate Land then and have it "carry over" to your turn.

 

[immortal grave walker]

so then your also saying i cant cast a natural affinity like that? I dont mean to soud rude on all of this, you guys are probably right, but it really doesnt make since. Can i cast a shock on end of turn effects on my opponants 4/4. then untap, shock it again and that creature take 4 points of damage?

 

[Mikeymike]

Excuse me while I go bury my head in the sand. Boy are the dudes I play with going to be pissed at me.

 

[Y The Alien]

Tag Guard

There is no "between turn effects". No, you can't do the Shock thing. No, you can't do the Natural Affinity thing. You also cannot get any effects except those that state that they end "at end of turn" and can be played as instants to carry over.

 

[immortal grave walker]

no you cant do what I wanted to do. Sometimes Im hard headed, but hay i was trying. Anyways i learn something new everyday. I understand now about end of turn and clean up ect.. hope i dint ruffle to many feathers. sometimes this game can be confusing,and cards can be miss understood.Anyways thanks for everyones input, im sure ill have more threads like this in the future.