Oh No You Didn't!

[DÛke]

(Intolerance deleted)

 

[Istanbul]

Kindly take all posts flaming someone else's religious views to the Battle Arena. Or better yet, keep them inside yourself and let them fester where they belong.

Hint: Not everyone that disagrees with you simply hasn't given it enough thought.

 

[DÛke]

So it looks like Istanbul deleted a post of mine regarding the "Intelligent Design" thread because he deemed it as "intolerance."

Intolerance!

I said nothing that was of the sort. I simply stated another opinion of mine, not attacking him or anyone. The reply was something along the lines:

"Agnosticism is indecision. It's weakness of mind. It says that people can't or wont think through these pressing matters and instead, in the name of 'wisdom,' push them aside and mark them as 'who knows' as they submerge themselves in the willy-nilly businesses of life."

Following that, I found it ironic that Istanbul talks about how people need to "make up their own mind" when he himself hadn't made up anything and simply chose to shove the issue aside with his "die-hard agnosticism."

That is simply all I have said! And he deletes my response because it's intolerance?

I am so sorry, I don't appreciate the fact that he could not handle a strong though insightful opinion and simply deleted it because he could not stand the fact that I was right in my questioning of his position regarding the issue.

Can someone tell me if indeed I was being intolerant? Can someone show me how? And also, has anyone else read what I exactly said in that post? It's laughable that it is deemed intolerant.

This is why I hate casual players. Because the ones who flaunt the fact most, the ones who flaunt their respect for the game, its values, its "heros," are exactly the ones who hide a darker under belly. Their over-blown exaggeration of their nobility betrays a secret contempt for others, on all levels.

What is still more ironic is how my post, which is "light" as far as my usual blunt style goes, is deleted because I questioned the very fact that he says "people should decide for themselves." Perhaps he should have been more tolerant of the fact that my opinion simply does not fit into his strict, dogmatic, indecisive paradigm? Perhaps...just perhaps...he should have let me, and everyone else, decide what is tolerant and intolerant?

But no, of all places on the internet, this place should have the least amount of such serious censorship and disrespect.

All this coming from a guy whose signature reads nothing else than "Think."

 

[DÛke]

Hint: I wasn't attacking you.

Hint: It wasn't intolerant.

Hint: You deleted it because you could not answer the questions I presented, because I was right, and you were, and are still wrong.

Hint: I've always found it amusing that you have as your signature the word "Think," because you wont allow neither yourself, and obviously, nor others, to think.

Amazing.

 

[evan d]

I did not find find your post to be improper or intolerant. In fact it caused me to look up what agnosticism means, And once I did, I actually agreed with you. I must therefore state that the most usable thing to learn is that you never even possibly make a slight at a mod.

 

[evan d]

No for Mister Imagineriraly a modderator to step in and clean this thread. Now to move the last few posts to the Battleground (flaming forum). Swipe!

 

[Istanbul]

No, you said that agnosticism was laziness and ignorance. You assaulted not only my faith, but my reasons for having it. Don't lie about the content of your post. Additionally, I never said I was a "die-hard agnostic." Don't lie about the content of my post, either.

I would delete any such blatant attack on another person's faith...even yours, Duke. If you have a problem, PM TomB and he can decide what to do about it. Since this thread was clearly meant to instigate and strike up attacks and controversy, I'm moving it to the Battle Arena where it belongs.

 

[DÛke]

Actually, it was meant to alert others like Spiderman and TomB that there is a corrupt moderator amongst them who is not only power-hungry, but power-hungry at the cost of free speech.

It is my opinion that agnosticism is laziness and ignorance. Do you think I'm wrong? Instead of whining like the little worthless shrivel of a mutt that you are, why don't you share with me why I am wrong? Here's an idea: why don't you use your "think"ing process and actually prove someone wrong for once, as opposed to censoring them using your oh so precious "mod skillz"?

Exactly.

I rest my case.

 

[Istanbul]

That is a blatant attack, Duke. Laziness and ignorance are character assassination statements, not value judgments. It's sort of like saying, "It's my opinion that all Jews should be shot."

Duke, this discussion is over. Talk to yourself. I've harbored your blatant flaming for far, far too long; you're not about reasonable discussion, as you like to claim in your lies, you're about attacking other people and trying to hide being pseudointellectualism. It's way past time I did something about it. I'll let the other mods decide who's right in this situation, but I've backed down from you for far, far too long. You are a bully and a bigot, and I'm sick to death of it. Let the line be drawn here.

 

[DÛke]

But it's not an attack when it's true!

[Useless flaming deleted - TomB]

 

[Istanbul]

Okay, that's enough. Thread closed. Any subsequent threads you try to start on this topic will be deleted until I get a ruling from other mods. I'm sorry, but you'll have to wait a short while before openly assaulting me further; I hope your ego can stand it.

 

[TomB]

Actually, it was meant to alert others like Spiderman and TomB that there is a corrupt moderator amongst them who is not only power-hungry, but power-hungry at the cost of free speech.

I hate to tell you this, DUke, but if your attacks on agnostics in general, and Istanbul in particular, was meant as an alert that Isty "is a corrupt moderator amongst them who is not only power-hungry, but power-hungry at the cost of free speech.", then I believe you are confusing cause and effect. Nowhere in Isty's earlier statement was there a hint of the crimes you accuse him of, only AFTER your post did he act as a moderator, and due to the way you said what you said I believe he acted appropriately. Granted, he's gotten a little harsh with you since, but I'm sure a part of that was on his part maybe feeling a bit like he was set up to overreact by YOUR posts.

In this country, we call that entrapment...

People, please don't feed the trolls!

 

[DÛke]

Just one thing for Istanbul, this is not an attack, but I'm trying to show you that you too can be wrong. You said you never said you were a "die-hard agnostic." Well?

Istanbul:

See, this is why I'm a die-hard agnostic. I don't know if there's a God, and if there is, I doubt we can properly understand it. Maybe we did just all show up, *poof*. Maybe we evolved. I can't say for sure...and neither can anyone else. That's why I think we should present options - couched as what they are, science, faith, or what-have-you - and let the individuals make their own decisions. Isn't that the most important thing we can learn anyway: how to make up our minds for ourselves?

Before you go around spreading rumours about how I lie about the content of posts, make sure you're not lying yourself. Thank you.

 

[Istanbul]

Very well. I misspoke; I am, in actuality, an agnostic but NOT a die-hard agnostic.

 

[Spiderman]

Well, I never got to see what DUke posted, so I can't make a ruling.

I do feel a bit uneasy about deleting content of posts - if someone feels that it's an attack or flame, it should be moved to the Battle Arena (which is what it's for, character assassinations or "fun battles". The only kind of posts I think are worth outright deleting is spam.

But I don't think posts from established users should be deleted. Everyone has something to say, whether it be worthwhile or not, and everyone should be able to see it and make their own judgements.

 

[DÛke]

"Agnosticism is weak-mindedness. It's thoughtless and it's pure indecision. It doesn't know what to believe, and doesn't want to think, perhaps because it can't think, so it shoves everything aside - in the name of wisdom, no less! - to busy itself in the willy-nilly businesses of life."

That statement above is really, really accurate.

I tried talking about it, but no one cares. TomB insists that it was offensive. While Istanbul insists that I wronged him, that I even engaged in what he calls "character assassination."

People don't want the Truth, or the possibility of it, they want to enclose themselves in a world of deluded subjectivity and half-baked lies. It's easier to dismiss something, to censor it, to crucify it, than to actually confront it on its levels, answer to it, and actually open up to the world of possibilities. Why answer to someone when you could just ignore them? or better yet, when you can just delete what they have to say so effortlessly with a click of a button (thank god for technology huh?)? why reflect when you could lose yourself in "the world"? why make a decision when you could embrace indecision as a decision? - that's essentially the case of agnosticism.

There really is no point of discussion when one side has completely shut itself off to everything that does not fit into its paradigm. It's such a shame...

 

[TomB]

TomB did not insist it was offensive - TomB said that he could see how an agnostic in general, and Istanbul in particular, could find it offensive considering that it was posted seemingly in direct response to Isty's declaration of agnosticism. TomB then supported Isty's decision to censor the inflammatory rhetoric while privately advising DUke to try to phrase his wording a bit more carefully in the future, so as to avoid needlessly turning what WAS an intelligent debate over this controversial issue into a flamefest, advice which seems to have been ignored, apparently.

Tone it down a bit DUke. You may not mean it this way, but your insulting verbiage won't work when discussing a subject like this. ALL people are entitled to their beliefs here, and NO ONE will be allowed to call other people names for expressing themselves.

Is that too hard to understand for you?

 

[DÛke]

TomB:

ALL people are entitled to their beliefs here, and NO ONE will be allowed to call other people names for expressing themselves.

Is that too hard to understand for you?

Not only is it hard to understand, but it is impossible to understand and, then, I refuse to understand it in this context, given the fact that I did not attack any single individual, only a single concept. Kind of like Gizmo discussing how he thinks religion is "sinful." Tell me, why has that not been deleted? Because he's not attacking anyone, only a concept. And yet, did I attack Istanbul? No. Only a concept.

The truth that you don't want to admit is that you, like Istanbul, have certain biased and, dare I say, a knack for power-trips which, by all means, you use as you please seeing as to how this forum has become anything-goes, with the moderators becoming "gods," or at least seeing themselves that way. I single out Spiderman because he is the only one who can, and has, kept both an open mind as well as an objective view of things. Without him, consider this forum and its moderators the most corrupt, infantile, and downright fascist.

But, that is just my opinion.

(P.S., I know, if I don't like it, I should leave - but aside from the corrupt ones, I have some good friends here.)

 

[TomB]

Well, DUke, if the only difference between us here is the opinion on my part that your post WAS an attack on Istanbul, and it's your opinion that it was not, and that the only problem I had with it was the way you said it and not the content of what you said, then maybe the answer to the issue is easy - it all goes away, as far as I am concerned, if you'd just stop being so damn insulting.

Easy, no?

 

[Gizmo]

Make Duke less insulting?

If you can manage that TomB, I'd believe that you were the second coming.