Nasty Tim Deck U/R

[Reverend Love]

Gizmo you paint a rosie scenario. Of course your deck is going to work when all the pieces fall exactly into place. My half-cocked Possess Portal abomination could work in that dreamy world. Where everything works as planned and your opponents are completely oblivious. A lovely place where there is no disruption and you can play at will. In the scenario you paint your absolutely right. Horseshoe Crab is woefully lacking.

However what happens if someone disrupts you're obvious combo of Intruder Alarm? Then you're ass out. Hoping to draw another Alarm with a Quicksilver Dagger enchanted Brassman. Maybe using what control you’ve splashed to slow them down.

After reading your post would I drop Brassman for Crab? No. But I'd certainly add him in favor of clown cards such as Hammerhead Shark, Vodalian Illusionist, or Abduction. Those are about dead draws. Even in your super scenario I fail to see how a drawn Abduction, Thropter Squadron, Alexi’s Cloak, or Hammerhead Shark opposed to another Brassman is going to help. Horsehow Crab could provide consistency. Especially with all the metagamed artifact hate (But this is entirely subjective).

But hey, if people are going to let you combo unmolested then WHOOPIE! Just hope no one who's played longer then a year decides to kick your combo out from under you.

 

[Oversoul]

Originally posted by Reverend Love
After reading your post would I drop Brassman for Crab? No. But I'd certainly add him in favor of clown cards such as Hammerhead Shark, Vodalian Illusionist, or Abduction. Those are about dead draws.

I would just like to point this out because I think it is an important point. There will be situations where Crab's advantage plays no role whatsoever and the thing is only a more expensive Brass Man. And more likely than not there are plenty of situations where the difference between untapping at any time and untapping during your upkeep costs you the game. Functionally, the cards are not all that different (mainly Crab is more versatile and Brass Man is a better early blocker against some decks). What is important is that one of them is drawn and can be successfully utilized with something like Quicksilver Dagger...

Hammerhead Shark is cute at least, but I don't know why you would even want to use Abduction. The deck doesn't have much reason to want that mechanic, and if it did, Control Magic is strictly better, Treachery is much better, and Charisma is probably better too (in this deck).

 

[jorael]

I played a U/W version with the 'cog' mechanic.

Combo:
4 brass man
4 viridian longbow

Enablers:
4 trinket mage
4 auriok salvagers

additional cogs:
4 aether spellbomb
4 Sunbeam Spellbomb
x meekstone (vs big beats)
x scrabbing claws (vs graveyard recursion)

The nice thing is that the brass-longbow combo becomes very stable. The spellbombs can be 'cycled' and trinket mage tutors.

Red and pyrite spellbomb can be added for direct damage and engineered explosives give you mass removal.

This isn't a true Tim deck anymore, but it can do a lot of stuff and is fun to play.

 

[Force of Will Smith]

Cog decks in general are kind of shaky.
Scabblling isnt really worth maindecking, and big beef sometimes only needs to hit you once.

you need to find more control or protection.


Here's a Salvager deck that i run.. it's pretty good but needs work.

with trinket mages you should run artifact lands, just in case you're mana screwed

8 Plains
6 Island
4 Ancient Den
4 Seat of the Synod

4 Ornithopter
4 Bonesplitter
4 Aether Spellbomb
4 Sunbeam Spellbomb

4 Leonin Squire
4 Trinket Mage
4 Myr Servitor
4 Grinding Station
3 Auriok Salvagers
2 Vedalken Mastermind
2 Serenity

Mastermind can bounce your trinkets or your squires.

You can even go aggro with fetching a couple bonesplitters on a ornithopter,

Mid to late game Salvagers and grindingstation.Play ornithopter and grinding station untaps, sac ornithopter. pay 1W to bring him to your hand.. play him again, repeat.
Sac artifact lands as well.
1W: Mill 3 cards.

 

[jorael]

Originally posted by Force of Will Smith
Scabblling isnt really worth maindecking

How much graveyard recursion does your playgroup use? The claws stop all graveyard sillyness and when not needed, they can be 'cycled'. Every game in our group somebody will abuse the graveyard. The claws stop that.

big beef sometimes only needs to hit you once.

Meekstone isn't always usefull, that's why I only added one. Myr servitor as an additional blocker seems good.


How usefull is Serenity? It destroys most of your own deck. When that happens and your Salvager is killed in response how do you remain control?

 

[Force of Will Smith]

it was actually a last add in. I origionally had 2 vanquish but i found them to be useless.. It was really just 2 filler cards, anything would work.


retribution of the meek, wraths, disenchant, swords to plowshares would work fine.

Serenity is usually just to be played against affinity early game. I can also usually always get back my artifacts. The salvagers aren't what makes the deck, it's the trinket mages and squires. Salvagers are o.k. thats why i only have 3. Typically it's ornithopter beatdown or searching and recurring a few spellbombs.

my artifacts are meant to blow up anyway. Plus no one uses serenity, and it's great against the nooblet players who only play type 2 to see a card that destroys every card in play on their side, that and people don't usually mind having an atog bounced before you do it... hehehe..

 

[Gizmo]

Originally posted by Oversoul
I would just like to point this out because I think it is an important point. There will be situations where Crab's advantage plays no role whatsoever and the thing is only a more expensive Brass Man. And more likely than not there are plenty of situations where the difference between untapping at any time and untapping during your upkeep costs you the game. Functionally, the cards are not all that different (mainly Crab is more versatile and Brass Man is a better early blocker against some decks). What is important is that one of them is drawn and can be successfully utilized with something like Quicksilver Dagger...

Hammerhead Shark is cute at least, but I don't know why you would even want to use Abduction. The deck doesn't have much reason to want that mechanic, and if it did, Control Magic is strictly better, Treachery is much better, and Charisma is probably better too (in this deck).

Abduction doubles as Control Magic, also defnsively on creatures I want to prevent being blown up, and combos powerfully with Hakim Loreweaver and/or Crown Of The Ages. Control Magic is better, but narrower (ie. it can only be used to steal my opponents creatures).

Hammerhead Shark is powerful... unlike Giant Tortoise whatever, the 2 power actually stops creatures attacking... say your opponent has 2 White Knights, if you have a Tortoise he swings and deals 2 each turn. With the Shark he sits there and doesnt dare attack. Shark >>>> Tortoise (those with long memories will remember seeing Hammerhead Sharks in almost all good blue decks from Tempest Block).

 

[Oversoul]

So basically you use Hammerhead Shark as a wall?

 

[Gizmo]

95% of it's function is as a second turn blocker, and then host for Quicksilver Dagger or Hermetic Study. The card closest to replacing it would be Wall Of Tears.

 

[mythosx]

Originally posted by Oversoul
I would just like to point this out because I think it is an important point. There will be situations where Crab's advantage plays no role whatsoever and the thing is only a more expensive Brass Man. And more likely than not there are plenty of situations where the difference between untapping at any time and untapping during your upkeep costs you the game. Functionally, the cards are not all that different (mainly Crab is more versatile and Brass Man is a better early blocker against some decks). What is important is that one of them is drawn and can be successfully utilized with something like Quicksilver Dagger...

Hammerhead Shark is cute at least, but I don't know why you would even want to use Abduction. The deck doesn't have much reason to want that mechanic, and if it did, Control Magic is strictly better, Treachery is much better, and Charisma is probably better too (in this deck).

Very good insight.

With the current enviroment of weak counter power. The brass man would be the obvious choice. And the deck provided by gizmo pretty much reflects this. The model which I think the reverend is using for his analysis and which I think would be stronger because it relies on maybe 1 card less involves more counters, control and disruption which would benifit from keeping all your BLUE mana open to do horrible things like counter or boomerang.

 

[Oversoul]

Yeah, when it comes to playing blue-based control, Force of Will and Mana Leak are your friends.

 

[Gizmo]

If I wanted to play to win, I'd take out about 40 cards, add some counters, and play CounterPhoenix.

Anyway, broken this deck up now... need the Shivan Reefs for a U/R Death Spark deck.

Death Spark + Merfolk Looter + Spiketail Hatchling + Spellshapers... that sort of thing. Death Spark is one of Richard Garfield's favourite cards, and I think it's about time I tried it out for myself.

 

[Force of Will Smith]

death spark is awesome. but u/r is a bizarre choice. I put together a red discard deck and its incredible. I use cards like


Death Spark
Mogg Fanatic (Synergy with Spark)
Chartooth Cougar (Synergy with spark)
Shard Phoenix (Synergy with spark)
Minotaur Explorer (Synergy with spark)
Pyromania
Hammer of Bogardan
Hanabi Blast
Sonic Burst
Sonic Seizure
Fiery Temper

it can deal excessive amounts of damage over a very very long group game or slay 1on1.