manchot posts a random sensitive topic that will create great controversy

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by manchot_13, Jul 26, 2000.

  1. manchot_13 New Member

    Who here believes in evolution? yes or no would be enough, or if you want to expand, feel free...

    and yes, i do... this is just something me and my friends bicker (don't know how to spell this) about all the time...

    just curious...
  2. garfobo Member

    U see im a Catholic, but im a Realist, and integrating those is tough heres my opinion! God creates Adam and Eve, and they are banished(see Bible for more), they go off, and because of various environmental changes, become primatal, when conditions return,God's Children become their trueselves, now i know this is sceptical but add in the fact i believe in God, i think he mightve had a hand in my theory, so there it is!
  3. Zadok001 CPA Founder, Greater Good

    I believe in evolution, but if you mention Darwin, I shoot you. (I read Origin of Species recently. If you haven't read it, DON'T. If you have, I'm so, so sorry. You have my complete and utter sympathy.)

    "And the next three hundred pages detail that individuals do, in fact, vary. Ding, dong."
  4. Fire Slinger Vetern CPA Member Pyromananic

    I believe in evolution. Did you know that our DNA is like 99.5% similiar to that of monkeys? Yes this will be a controveral subject. This was the subject of my world history class last semester and two people almost got into a fist fight arguing over the evolution/creation theory. I guess it depends on if you believe in God(s) or not.

    [Edited by Fire Slinger on July 27th, 2000 at 12:01 AM]
  5. FoundationOfRancor The Gunslinger

    Well, I have my own religion. It closely follows survival of the fittest. There fore, i do beleave in evolution. Very much so.
  6. Hawaiian mage CPA symbiod

    Now I beleive in a god but I don't beleive in the bible(the bible is so messed up. For example, Noahs Arc, the number of insect species all combined would have made theboat sink. And why bother to bring Rats and Snakes when the bible says they'er evil?)

    I figure there is some sort of god that just creates blue alge. Since there is no way to explain how life began I just came upwith that assumption.
    How ever, the god could care less about blue alge, which is all we really are just more evolved. So he/she/it just goes and creates more on another planet. That alge was made on every planet in the solar system but it only succeded here.

    Any way, I'm sure you all could care less about my ludcrouse theorys that would have got me killed 500 years ago.

    But there is just so much eveidence that proves evolution exists. And all there is to support a god are preists from 2000 years ago that claimed to see a sonova god then later start enforceing the religion accross the world. Which is what leads me to beleive...
  7. Duster Protection from Idiots

    Wow, theological is a big word...

    Anyway, a buddy of mine, Steve, and I discuss religion frequently at work. He's really the only person that's gotten me interested in the subject. I've come to completely agree with most of his beliefs.

    So here goes...
    God created man in order to view himself. Meaning God created man in his own image (that's in the Bible if I'm correct?) He did this so He could 'live' because I'm sure being God can be pretty boring. So humanity is created so God can experience himself, He can know himself through us, and that essentially is the meaning of life.

    That paragraph essentially made no sense, but that's no here nor there. If you got my point, great, if not, don't sweat it.

    So Steve and I started discussing evolution and the big bang, etc. We came to the conclusion that God has all the time in the world, so He created the big bang, I mean, what's a few millenia to wait for humans to arrive, to God?
    So essentially, God had everything planned out, He just didn't care how long it takes.

    We also believe in reincarnation, people go to heaven (or whatever) and are eventually 'recycled' based on their previous lives.


    If I wasn't so tired I might better explain my opinions, so sorry :)

    Catch my drift? Didn't think so!


    Yeah, I'm Dustin
  8. Chaos Turtle Demiurgic CPA Member, Admin Assistant

    1) Evolution? Well, duh.

    2) Don't get me started on Biblical inconsistency.

    3) Don't get me started on scientific inconsistency.

    4) Evolution is an undeniable fact of existence. But there have been dramatic leaps of evolution over time, that seem to confound the notion that it hapens slowly and gradually.

    Of course it does happen slowly and gradually, but those leaps - frequently occuring after mass extinctions - might lead one to believe that there is a logical and sentient force behind it.

    I choose to believe that Whatever created the universe set up an order to things. There are rules of nature that must be followed, and within this framework, we have evolved just as Whatever it was intended.

    Sometimes I think that it's a kind of game, or experiment. Like "I wonder what will happen if I smash a huge asteroid into this planet? ... Oh... Well, dinosaurs were boring anyway."

    I am also one of those who, while aware that humans have somehow managed to step outside the evolutionary chain (we adapt our environment, rather than adapting to it, thus negating the effect of random mutation) I am not so arrogant as to assume that we are the "last step" in the chain. All we need is a catalyst, to facilitate the nest huge evolutionary leap. Unfortunately, the catalyst typically seems to be global catastrophe, so - while I'm curious to know what it might be like to witness the next step in human evolution - I don't really want to be around for whatever brings it about.

    Of course, I'm willing to listen to and consider any rational, reasonable theories anyone else might have, as well.

    Toodles! ;)
    (fixed a screwy vB tag...messy, messy)

    [Edited by Chaos Turtle on July 27th, 2000 at 07:30 AM]
  9. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    I believe in evolution and am open-minded to the existence of a "Higher Being".

    Not necessarily "God" as defined in the Bible because there has been at least one set of religious views that were around a heck of a lot longer than Christianity/Judaism (ancient Egypt).

    But one that COULD include such characteristics and qualities as "God" does in the Bible.

    I second CT on Biblical and scientific inconsistencies.

    And that's about that.
  10. garfobo Member

    What I and Ishmael both find interesting is how humans all of a sudden consider themselves the end of evolution, the final creation, im not saying all of us do, but Mother Culture sure does whisper in a lot of ears, what we must realize is that we are no more important than a snake or jellyfish, and there are other evolutionary stages that will outclass us!
  11. Hawaiian mage CPA symbiod

    Weren't there some test made that proved that Dolphines were actually smarter then humans? I remeber that from some where...

    And cockaroaches are going to out live us all, most of you all ready know why.

    So if we cross breeded cockaroaches and dolphines...
  12. Multani Treetrunk Guy

    Tag Guard

    I have no religion. This means I believe and support evolution. I look at the Big Bang from a scientific point of view.

    Speaking of debating religion, I remember I did that once in 3rd grade against my entire lunch table. I always seem to be outnumbered... :(
  13. Duster Protection from Idiots

    Man, I hope I didn't come off as saying that humans are the be all and end all of creation.
    I certainly hope we're not anyway.

    I think I misstated a lot of things I said last night, it was 4am, and I had just gotten out of work (grrr 10 hr shift).

    So that said, I was talking a lot out of my ass. I didn't exactly mean God created humanity for himself, but life, every living thing. Basically I agree with a lot of what CT said, about an order etc. And God (not necessarily Christian) created life for himself, kind of like a game I guess. God can play this game forever, but even this game has rules :)

    So yeah, I agree with most of you guys, with a few of my own beliefs, that I can't seem to get to come out right in writing.

    This doesn't make much more sense that what I said previously, I think I'll just shut up now :)


    Yeah, I'm Dustin
  14. theorgg Slob

    I belive in God. I belive in his guiding evolution.

    I do not wish to discuss more, because it always gets me depressed. I don't think we were made to fathom the mysteries of God. I belive in him(using the englishly correct "him" when gender is unknown.) and believe he does things for the good of his plan...

    I'm not uptight, I just don't like discussing it.


    and as for Evolution of a spiecies, don't read it. It's amlost too boring to understand, and nearly impossible to discern. you've read the paragraph about survival of the fittest? that's all you need to know. put his book on the bookshelf with the anatomy of a guy named grey(who, by chance, has a MUCH more understandable book!).

    If you'd like to read somthing pretty good about this subject, read Good Omens by Neil Gaiman and Terry Pratchett. It's a pretty good book that deals with angels, demons, and the Metatron, or Voice of God.

    God Bless,
    -The ORGG
  15. terzarima New Member

    Hey,
    I beleive very much in evolution, you've all probably heard in biology about how different animals have ADAPTED over a long span of time to certan circumstances.
    EX:
    How the rabbits fur turns white during the winter so that the rabbit's predators cannot see it.

    Now since these adaptations over time have changed the animals into what they are today, is that not a small scale of evolution? I mean through Charles Darwins theory, which I'm not saying I agree with, we evovled from primates, but why? We are more vulnerable as homo Sapiens, easier to infect, no thick skin, no large muscles to help us along. So I don't beleive that that theory is correct, but it could be true.
  16. terzarima New Member

    Also If you look at the different stories of creation from different cultures its actually quite interesting. Norse mythology says that man was a peice of washed up timber that the gods shaped and breathed life into.

    But if you look and cross two cultures together like Christianity and the aztec religion they were very similar, they both had a single creator, and both had a large flood that flooded the entire world. Also other creation stories beleive that the world was completely covered with water when they lived on it. (Que X-files Music) Coincidence?
  17. FoundationOfRancor The Gunslinger

    I think everyone here should read the book ISHMEAL by daniel quiin, it'll put some stuff in perspective. Anyway, I think that there is a god, but hes not into the whole "Our culture" thing, I think he follows the law of nature 9it should be plural, cuz theres alot). "our" culture (Notice I didnt say humans) have produced a agriculture that for many reaons (I dont want to type them all, I will if you want) has allowed us to expand outward from these laws (fpr good or worse..probalbly worse). Anyway....back to my point, evolution revolves alot around death, and our culture has brought our friend death (he is our friend .....or she) to amost a stand still (Compared to what it wa 10 thousand years ago. So, we have put almost a stop to evolution.
  18. manchot_13 New Member

    16 posts and counting! Great!

    My commentary:

    1) hey i like the Origin of Species
    2) humans are not the end of evolution, god is (at least in my view)


    My views: copied from an aim discussion
    i don't think the universe has a begging or an end in time
    manchot 13: i don't think he started the ball rolling
    manchot 13: i think the ball transcends time
    however
    manchot 13: i don't think i am nessessarily willing to say that god didn't have a begginning
    manchot 13: he may be what evolution is approaching
    my view on existence scientifically (without the integration of religion)
    manchot 13: existence
    manchot 13: was
    manchot 13: existence is
    manchot 13: existence will be
    manchot 13: but...
    manchot 13: existence continually resets itself on a regular basis
    manchot 13: (ie the big bang)
    manchot 13: each time is a new round for life
    manchot 13: but each time life is destroyed and must start again
    MDH N64: Hmmm.
    manchot 13: the ultimate goal therefore
    manchot 13: is to reach the point where there is no physical aspect to life
    MDH N64: (... Elaborate.)
    manchot 13: this is known by scientists and a few evolutionists as transcendence
    manchot 13: essentially now life is composed of two elements
    manchot 13: the body and the mind
    manchot 13: if the body goes, life ends
    manchot 13: therefore the destruction of the universe is like a reset button on life
    manchot 13: but.. if life could transcend this boundry (the body) it could continue indeffinitely beyond this point
    manchot 13: and theorettically continue forever
    manchot 13: make sense?
    MDH N64: If the mind could transcend the body, it could live on.
    manchot 13: exactly
    manchot 13: and the mind could become the body
    MDH N64: Do you have ANY clue how this is remotely possible?
    manchot 13: well
    manchot 13: as i see it now
    manchot 13: thought doesn't take place entirely in our brains now
    MDH N64: (Sounds like Plato... "it is the ideas that are real, all else is an illusion." And of course some of religion...)
    manchot 13: it must (according to some) have some other method
    manchot 13: the goal is of course to maximize this and minimize the rest
    MDH N64: Maximize and minimize what?
    manchot 13: maximize the mind, minimize the body
    manchot 13: and eventually the body will dissappear
    manchot 13: in some ways we could draw the conclusion that god is just someone who made it all the way
    manchot 13: this i am not sure about
    MDH N64: Maximize and capitalize on the thinking... because it is mostly something beyond the physical and electrical makeup of neurons and such.
    manchot 13: exactly
    manchot 13: which is exactly what the evolution of humans has been about
    MDH N64: That much makes sense.
    MDH N64: (Yet how on earth could this be "maximized"?)
    manchot 13: but as it stands, evolution is unlikely until we isolate into small groups again
    manchot 13: such as planetary exploration
    manchot 13: or a great disaster
    MDH N64: <nods>
    manchot 13: it wouldn't be on earth
    MDH N64: Evolution of the mind.
    manchot 13: after all... the mind is (at least in my view) not of the earth
  19. TheDevil565 New Member

    OK, here's what I believe:

    God is very real, but I've come to a conclusion: He doesn't give a damn about any of us in general, just us as a species. Look at the movie Saving Private Ryan when a man is saved from a bullet by his helmet, only to have the helmet removed by a doctor and then he's shot in the head. See, when I saw that, even though it's just a movie, I realized that basically we are all on our own in this world. Trust no one but yourself, and still pray to God because He exists and He will expect some tribute for creation. But don't trust Him to guide you through all of life's little teensy tiny problems because He does not care that you have a little hangnail that you pray will get out. So don't count your blessings, just go out there and do your best in life because for all we know that could be all there is, and no one's going to ever prove that the afterlife does or does not exist and if it does, who says it'll be pleasant? As for evolution, it's already been proved. So of course I support it.

    (And no one comment that a Devil is preaching)
  20. Duel Has Less Posts Than Spiderman

    I believe in evolution of all forms, including (And here I am a rarity) societal evolution, the cream rises to the top.

    I don't believe in god. You hear that, big guy? I don't believe in you! You wanna piece of me? You, me, here, now!

    [me] dodges the lightning bolt [/me]

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