Long Antics

[Spiderman]

Well, I don't know if you all really care about this, but any thoughts on Mike Long's personal shuffling techniques? I only got tantalizing references to it from Dave Price and another Pro report yesterday and then this morning on the Dojo, Robert Dougherty explained what had happened (from his view) and his analysis of the shuffling technique. It sure sounds like stacking but I haven't tried it yet so heck if I know.

I guess a tangent thought that occurred to me also while reading it is that there seems to be a need for professional trained judges to better be able to look for this sort of thing. I know this has been raised on the Dojo many a time so I don't really expect a response on this, but there could probably be a better judging system than relying on volunteers and past players (well, maybe better training in the case of the latter).

 

[theorgg]

Yea. I've seen that thing in a trick book. It's pretty complicated. you have to know exactly what to do.

as for the long incedent, I'm making this public a little early, and suprisingly, this was made before the "incedent" was publicized by everybody recently

http://www.brainburst.com/freesite/tvsmtg/longthrow.gif

 

[Dune Echo]

That was amusing! You got a snort outta me on that one Jensen.

 

[Zadok001]

The stacking trick isn't too hard to pull off. I've been dabbling with card tricks for several years, that was the third or fourth one I managed to get down. It's just a matter of keeping the cards close to you so no one can see you cut-shuffle. Which, from what I've heard, is _exactly_ what Long did. :-\ He really should have gotten suspended, if not banned, IMHO. He sure as hell did more than McFarrel.

I don't think it matters whether the judges know what to look for in this. (Btw, what you look for is holding the cards close to the torso, and the right hand (assuming the cheater is right handed) being angled about 30 degrees inward when the deck is being pushed together.) Once they knew Long was shuffling incorrectly, it should have been a suspension. Searching the deck is irrelevant, he cheated. I'll draw an example from elsewhere: If a poker dealer is dealing off the bottom of the deck from one player, it doesn't matter whether the card being dealt is an Ace or a 10. It's still cheating.

 

[Ferret]

I recently read a rather long PTLA tourney report (from the guy that made the Top 8, but lost to Mike Long). Throughout the match Long kept trying to get under the guy's skin w/ offhand comments and such and it helped him win...

In another match he stole the guy's pen just to keep him distracted - even though he had his own pen hanging around his neck. Again, he won.

He doesn't just cheat; he uses psychological warfare. He does everything necessary to win - and this works for him since he's still in the game, still winning, still getting asked to participate in the Invitationals....

...and here's the worst part: the better he does the bigger a role model he becomes to new players who want to do well on the Pro Tour....

-ferret

"...more reasons to remain Casual..."

 

[Baron Sengir]

Long is the Antichrist of what we stand for. The man uses some of the most deplorable, underhanded tricks I've ever heard of. He has now become the example of all we strive against, IMHO.

If I get one of those freakin' merfolk from my nemesis boosters, I'm gonna poke a hole through his eyes and send the damn things to him. Shuffle this, bastard!

Whoa. Got a little out of control there. Screw him. Let's have fun playing cards.

I remain
The Baron
"easy, Baron ... take your ritalin ..."

 

[TomB]

Hey Orgg,
T STRIKES AGAIN!!!

Great stuff!

Baron,
The Anti-Christ, huh?

OK. I'll go for that.

Funny thing is, any number of his peers amongst the pros would agree with you too.

What a scumbag.

TomB
CPA Member

 

[Spiderman]

Zadok: Your point is the point Rob Dougherty was making, but it seemed that since Long's deck didn't seem to be "stacked" in the "usual" ways (all or non-land clumps), the judges didn't think that his shuffling technique was cheating after all. Which seems to lead that awareness needs to be made about the different ways one can stack his deck and shuffle to his advantage (i.e. training).

Ferret: Yeah, it seems Long should have been penalized a long time ago for "unsportsmanlike conduct", at the very least! What's going on here? (rhetorical)

 

[Ferret]

Well, to answer your rhetorical question: Mike Long is a good player that wins consistently and I think that the DCI thinks it needs a bad boy - like other sports have:

Baseball has Darrel Strawberry and John Rocker

Basketball has Dennis Rodman

Football has the Dallas Cowboys - and the referees of most of the post season games.

Magic has Mike Long. He's the bad boy showing everyone that you don't have to play fair - or even play nice - to win the big bucks...

-ferret

"...I just remembered why I hate organised sports..."

 

[Spiderman]

I think the difference between Long and those you named is that Long is a "bad boy" while playing the game while the others are noted for their "off-field" antics.

Have no idea about Strawberry.

Rocker made comments in an interview. He didn't (I don't think) doctor his baseball during pitched which would be more comparative.

Rodman... well, he has refused to practice a couple times and seems to prefer gambling than playing. He's comparable.

The Cowboys have actually been out of the news for a couple years, ever since they instituted some "player-oversight" person. I probably would have said Carruth and Ray Lewis as they are in the news now, but again, it's all off the field. Maybe someone "on-the-field" would be Mark Carrier, whom the Redskins are pursuing and is a "heavy hitter with a length of fines and suspensions to prove it (Post, 2/16/00).

I guess I also would have said pro wrestlers?

I don't know the exact penalties for each infraction on the Pro Tour, but I would guess Long does and knows how to anticipate how the judges would react to his questionable methods. So he knows what he can get away with because he pretty much knows what the penalties are going to be in advance.

Is he a good player because of his playing style? Or rather, what it does to his opponents? How would he do if he just shut up and sat there and played "normally"? In other words, is he a good player by himself or does he owe it to his style?

 

[Ferret]

I would say it's a combination of the two.

He is an excellent player. That cannot be denied. He has shown that he can do well in any format...however, I think he likes to toy w/ people's minds so that even if they're as good as him they'll be taken off guard so that he can run all over them.

He's really good at the mental game as well as the actual game...

-ferret

"...if he weren't such a jerk I'd have respect for him..."