CPA Voting Issues: Size/Speed of new sets for Magic

Discussion in 'CPA/WOTC Magic Issues' started by Dune Echo, Apr 20, 2000.

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  1. Dune Echo CPA Founder, Idea Man

    Okay everyone. It seems like everyone is done voting on the first of three issues to discuss and report to Wizards. This thread will deal with size and speed of future sets and how the casual player feels about it. Please try to stick to the subject so we can get a clear idea of how people feel. I think this thread should be closed after May 5th (one day after my birthday!) to give people plenty of time to voice their opinion but to also put a deadline on the issue.

    So, have fun arguing everyone!
  2. Mundungu grumpier than ever

    Well, being very casual, I really have a hard time coping with three expansions a year. I am not sure it is very realistic to expect less exapnsions, as Wizards need to make money.

    However, they definitly not should change the basic set (6th) edition so often.
    I'd rather see a bigger set with lot of gooddies that stays stable longer. Maybe if instead of 1 big expansion and 2 small, a bigger base set with valuale cards and 3 small expansions.

    I honestly tend to buy more from the small extensions than form the big ones (outside the basic set) because the chances to get the card you want and a complete set are just much more reasonable.
  3. Apollo Bird Boy

    I completely agree with Mundungu. I think they should be slowed a little, but that would never happen. Changing the large expansion to a small one would be a nice compromise.

    Apollo
  4. Ura Feline Lord of the Pit

    While I have nothing wrong with seeing three sets a year and the size, I would like to see better quality in the sets. Something with power like the Urza's block but not broken and something with the mobility of the masques block with out being bird cage liner. Also seeing a better balance between useful spells and useful creatures would be nice.
    Though I think I could handle seeing 4 sets a year insted of three. ;)
  5. arhar Member

    Definetely slow down.

    And yes, I think ALL the sets, including basic set should be 150 cards. Because when you buy packs of Saga, for example, for every Processor, Sneak Attack or Gaea's Cradle you get a Discordant Dirge, Antagonism, etc. Same thing (only even worse) with MM and 6th. Although I've been having strangely good luck with 6th ed packs - I've bought not a lot of packs but pulled a City of Brass, Millstone, Nightmare, and all the other rares I pulled were useful casual cards like BIG MIGHTY Pearl Dragon!!!!! Yeah baby, yeah! Well, that's off topic :D Anyway, it's much better to know that there are only 150 cards in the set and only so many rares, so the same thing as what happened to my friend wouldn't happen to you - 2 Boxes of Saga, NO Morphlings and NO Cradles :))) In the end, he was going like "Finally!!! Something good! A LIFELINE!!!" :)))
  6. Chaos Turtle Demiurgic CPA Member, Admin Assistant

    Since starting school again I have had a hard time keeping up with the pace. I've stopped buying packs altogether.

    I wouldn't mind seeing the sets coming a little farther apar.
  7. TomB Administrative Assistant

    I hear ya', CT. I've 2 kids, a mortgage, tons of bills, and a new manager at work who believes the whole concept of overtime pay is an inherently evil thing :( .

    I think WotC would do us all a big favor by paring down the sizes of all the sets by trimming out the chaff cards. I think more people would be interested in investing in the game if they knew that every time they bought a booster pack they'd be getting a useful card in terms of constructed play. I know several people who gave up the game simply because they couldn't keep up, and quite a few others who, once they heard about just how much it would cost to become competitive, refused to even THINK about getting into the game.

    In other words, they'd likely end up making MORE money that way, and have a larger customer base to boot.

    I also think the idea of having a stable base set is a good one. This way, people would know they could invest in it and KNOW the cards would be good for years to come.

    TomB
    CPA Member
  8. The Magic Jackal Veteran CPA Member<BR><font co

    I really have no problem with the card sets, which is kind of funny. I seem to survive on an $10 a week allowance, and most of that goes to playing in tournaments. I seem to have gotten 4 of each of the good nemesis cards. Don't ask me how. I have won a lot of packs in tournaments, that might explain it
  9. Killer Joe Active Member

    ...I was just thinking that if Wiz Co. released a core set every two years and theme expansions (150 cards or less) about five times over the two year period, might be a good idea. Each expansion could be like a chapter in the on-going storyline or even a sub-plot storyline (i.e. "Mirri: the early years).
  10. Spaceman Spiff New Member

    I think Wizards should think more about the casual players and not to much more about the T2 players or they could make like 2 base sets and 4 expansions in one set kinda thing and that way it could be like 3 for T2 tournament players and 3 for casual players and the cards in the casual boosters would be like the more useful, handy, and broken cards well as the T2 boosters would have all the hard-to-use cards for the tournament enviroment, this is my idea
    im open to suggestions...
  11. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    I think they should do away with the stand-alones and just have the basic sets with expansions, the way it used to be in days of yore. SO I guess what Yellowjacket said.... :)
  12. Mr_Pestilence Wumpus

    How about this?

    The first expansion, Arabian Nights, was approximately 90 cards, and it still had plenty of useful, interesting, and powerful cards.

    Why not keep the same release schedule, but limit each expansion to 90 cards?

    This would by itself eliminate the "filler" cards, and allow for more playtesting because there would be fewer cards to concentrate on.

    Also, you could probably get an entire set out of one box, as opposed to buy 3-4, or breaking the bank buying singles.
  13. galtwish Loudmouth

    1 Major (350 cards) stand alone every 18 months
    1 expansion (150 cards) to the stand alone every 6 months
    1 Classic update (100 cards) every year. This set is Chronicles: every year WotC will reprint 100 cards from past expansions in 8 card packs for $2 a pack. They don't all have to be tournament legal, but most (90 or so) should be. Maybe make the 10 non-tourney legal cards foils? These non-tourney legal cards should be super fun, like Serra Angel, Sengir Vampire, Sliver Queen, Sol'Kanar, even Serendib Efreet and Kird Ape. This would mean they would sell for fun players, for collectors, and for the few T1.5/T1 players out there. These Chronicles updates should also be every year so that the following can take place:
    NO NEW "CLASSIC" SET. We would be stuck with 6th Ed. and the current rotation of Chronicles for the base set indefinately. This would go a long way in promoting the "classic game" aspect of Magic and make it easier for people to get into/come back to/stay with casually. You could even venture to say that 50-100 cards could be cut from 6th to keep it the same size with the Chronicles expansion.

    Erik
  14. Mr_Pestilence Wumpus

    mmmmmmmmmmmmm....

    Foil Sol'kanar.......

    mmmmmmmmmmmmm....
  15. Istanbul Sucker MCs call me sire.

    Actually, I see nothing wrong with the release rate of the expansions. Just when we're hungering for something new, we get it. I know I'm already anxiously awaiting Prophecy.

    I WOULD like to see the size of the expansions trimmed down, though. The average standalone is 350 cards, and the average expansion is 143. I wouldn't mind seeing that trimmed down to 300 cards per standalone and 120 cards per expansion.
  16. galtwish Loudmouth

    Sorry, the Rotating Chronicles idea was not fully expalined:

    100 cards
    every 18-24 months (I wrote 1 year and didn't go back and fix it)
    90 legal cards, 10 "chase" cards that could be foil, gold bordered (but legally backed for tournament play), alternate art, etc. Here would be my vote for the first 10 chase cards:
    Serra Angel
    Sengir Vampire
    Sol'Kanar, the Swamp King
    Serendib Efreet
    Wasteland
    Sliver Queen
    Maro (so the damn thing will get printed, just kididng Mr. Rosewater)
    Icy Manipulator
    Balance
    Fork
    none would be T2 legal unless it was in the basic set (as 7th is already in the works/ready for printing. Therefore the new Chronicles sets would have to mesh with 7th)
    Mmmmm, foil Sol'Kanar....

    erik
  17. Captain Caveman New Member

    I like Erik's idea.

    This is what I'd like to add. If the 90 cards
    were Black Border, I'd buy Chronicles II, III,
    IV and so on.

    BB Cards & Foils, sounds fun to me. The whole
    Black Border thing is just self interest.


    I'd like to see the sets issued as follows:

    Base- Core Edition(350 Cards every two years)
    Chronicles (100 Cards every year)
    Stand Alone(250 New Cards)
    SA Expansion one (100 New Cards)
    SA Expansion two (100 New Cards)

    The Stand Alone + Expansions could be offered @
    24 packs per boxes. (12 cards/retail@ 2.49 or
    something)

    This idea isn't going to do much for the
    tournament scene but could potentially boost
    sells.

    Ok, I'll tap my Three BB Plains, my BB Sol Ring
    (Chronicles II)and play my BB Serra Angel.
    Done!
    Caveman
  18. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    Capt. Caveman: I don't think any reprint is going to be black-bordered; that's reserved for first-print runs and to preserve collectibility and so you know which card came from which set (since they included the original expansion symbol on the cards from Chronicles).
  19. Almindhra Magic's Bitch

    Its fine and dandy with me how many sets they put out a year...I can't wait till Prophecy and see all the new decks that will come out it...Right now I'm bored with the same old same old...
  20. galtwish Loudmouth

    One thing I do like is that the card sets are becoming more interesting. Mirage block had only about a half dozen viable decks for Standard, while Rath cycle blew the gate open and brought that to about 8-10 teir one decks. Urza's cycle kind of limited T2 unfortunately, due to it's interaction with rath, and only about 4-5 decks were teir 1, mostly due to 6th being a non-entity during the short time all three were in rotation. Masques by itself gave us about 10 teir 1 decks for standard, but Nemesis has limited us to only 4 or 5 once again. Hopefully Prophecy will rescue us from theis abysmal pit we call Replenish.
    The real point of this post is to show that unless the DCI reinstitutes the B&R list, R&D will have to release sets rapidly to prevent formats from becoming stale and dominated by the combo, control, or beatdown archtype. It's got to be one or the other.

    Erik
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