Casual vs. Tournament play.

[mythosx]

I think tournament level play takes the fun out of Magic. Its like training for sports. No one wants to do pushups or run 5 miles. we just want to play. I started this thread in light of Trains post. I just want to get a feel for the general idea of everyone on the site.

 

[Ferret]

Originally posted by mythosx
I think tournament level play takes the fun out of Magic. Its like training for sports. No one wants to do pushups or run 5 miles. we just want to play. I started this thread in light of Trains post. I just want to get a feel for the general idea of everyone on the site.

Well, I would agree. Most of the times I've played in sanctionned events I've faced 20% nice people 40% quiet people that are pretty serious, and 40% people that are REALLY into winning. I know this isn't a real cross-section of the tourney players out there, it's just what I've faced (kind of like the results of a USA Today Poll).

I always enjoyed playing w/ the nice people and the quiet ones at least were humble in both victory or defeat...however, the "winners" usually spend half their time trash talking about how lame your deck is and the other half telling you how original their net.decks are...

-Ferret

"Of course, I've seen my share of jerks playing casually as well..."

 

[Notepad]

I agree wholeheartedly. After training to get ready for Regionals back in 2001, I discovered I hated the whole "guantlet" and all that stupid testing crap. Sure, we all think about what will mess up our decks and build accordingly, but trust me, no casual player comes close to doing the psychotic regiments that pros and tourney players go through.

 

[Spiderman]

It depends if you can keep them separate or expect them to go hand-in-hand. If you go to a tournament expecting "fun" in general, I think you're being overly optimistic/naive. People are there to win and while it would be nice to have friendly people to play against, unless you get points for being nice, they're not forced to being so.

If you keep them separate, then you don't have a problem. You don't have to go to a tourney to have fun. And if you find/play against someone who is a jerk in that kind of setting, just pick up and walk away. No one's forcing you to play that person.

 

[train]

I'd recommend a handgun - a big one...

 

[Nightstalkers]

I've been ejected from my local tourney for a couple of weeks so far, and am tiding over by boosting their competitions sales through the roof.


Casual play rules, man! Screw T2! T1 RULES!!!!

 

[mythosx]

Suggestion noted train. I'll strap an AA gun to my car a la Call of Cthullu style. YOU DONT GO IN MAN! YOU BLOW THE FRIGGIN HOUSE DOWN. I noted what you said ferret and I feel almost like you. Whats the deal with the trash talkers anyways? I havent been to a tournament. But my friends inform me that they basically play against the same three decks that were pulled off the net.

do you think a pro player can do well in a casual setting? Alot of t2 tourney decks run out of steam after killing one person. There should me a multi player tournament format. That would mix things up. Make everything a bit more chaotic like in real life.

 

[Spiderman]

Your friends should be able to build a deck that could defeat the three net decks then...

I think pro players can do well in a casual/MP setting (the two are not inclusive). Not the decks necessarily, but they can probably build some good casual/MP decks.

 

[train]

There should me a multi player tournament format. That would mix things up. Make everything a bit more chaotic like in real life

That's exactly what th e push for our rights thread is about... and I know Mythosx has already been there...

but another mention of it wouldn't hurt...

 

[Nightstalkers]

Man, us causal players are always gettin' screwed over by T2 tourneys.


when can us guys with the larger collections actually use those hard earned cards? Howabout a T1 worldwide tourney? that sure would have been sweet to celebrate the 10th anniversary for .\\agic.

 

[mythosx]

I thought there were type 1 worldwide tourneys. I could have sworn this site had a link a month ago to an article about them. It was really dry, kinda like reading a profession journal. Took the fun out of magic and put me to sleep. Im more leaning to train on this one. Im looking for a melee style tournament. Not just type 1. Cuz I think people who play type 1 duels pretty much run the same decks also. IF they can afford it.
The original idea of this post however, was to measure the playing styles and capabilities of tournament t2 type players versus casual players. Whos more creative? who has a better grasp of rules? I had right before i left the states gotten into a debate over the card underworld dreams. He said it wasn't so good and I nearly lost it. But in retrospect he was referring to type 2. In which yeah...it sucks. In casual play however, underworld dreams in my opinion is pretty darned good. This difference in opinion is very interesting to me.

 

[Nightstalkers]

I'm a pretty hearty T1 player and I don't really use the same deck until I can safely say that its the best it can be.

Then I choose another color on my color wheel, and start a new.

 

[Spiderman]

We (hopefully) already know that WOTC makes cards in a set geared towards different formats (Standard, Sealed) and types of play (tournament, MP) and the card that is good in more than one is the one that's going to be one of the more expensive ones because of its demand.

So a card could be good in MP and not in the tourney scene and a dedicated tourney player will usually recognize that. The casual player may also, or may not, but may still try to use the card for a variety of reasons: 'cause they like it, 'cause it's "janky", 'cause it goes against the "established opinion" and want to have a surprise element or whatever...

I think in general there's not one side who's "better" than the other. Each has different goals.

 

[train]

Whos more creative? who has a better grasp of rules? I had right before i left the states gotten into a debate over the card underworld dreams. He said it wasn't so good and I nearly lost it. But in retrospect he was referring to type 2. In which yeah...it sucks. In casual play however, underworld dreams in my opinion is pretty darned good. This difference in opinion is very interesting to me.

I don't think it's who's more creative - I think it's their intentions...

Honestly - I watched so many different decks in the tourney last night - and all but 1 were casual - and the one that was not - didn't win... why - caus it was geared to handle tourney decks - not casual "here - Let me beat you with 57 dragon tokens" decks...

As for grasps on rules - casual players have a decent grasp on rules, and honestly - some don't care for them - make your own rules and limits to teams/multiplayer, and enjoy the fellowship of gaming...

 

[Spiderman]

The rules are there to provide a basis of play so you don't have to keep asking your opponent "okay, so do you play with the restriction of 4 of every card" or whatever. You can throw out the rules at the agreement of the other player.

 

[train]

You can throw out the rules at the agreement of the other player.

You can also throw out the other player...

To note - this is usually how play groups get formed - types of play, and rules followed...

"It's a great way to see the casual side of the game..."

 

[Spiderman]

In my experience, usually groups form to have people to play with. But we already agree to play by the "real" rules...

 

[train]

this is usually how play groups get formed - types of play, and rules followed...

Well... typically - the way you meet people who play Magic is via the internet - at local shops/tourneys, or at pre-releases...

The way it develops on the net is mostly chat, and now MTGO... and even there - you play in certain rooms, and usually dela with people you want to play against - every now and then you hit the tourney freak...

As for local shops - you begin hanging around players in the shop, and groups can form through idea-sharing and play-testing... even going out to eat...

as for the big tourneys - you tend to be in the middle of a mass of people form EVERYWHERE... so when you find someone that may live close to you - you tend to talk to them more, and maybe set up a time to meet/play...

Magic can be brought forth in casual talk/play, but only if something is going on - like you may be working with your cards and someone notices it and takes an interest... or you may be asking for days off to travel for a tourney, and people wonder why, and then get interested...

someitmes - in my case - people get on your system and note your favorites and wonder what the fascination is with all those sites and then get interested...

cards on the work desk are also in my case...

 

[Spiderman]

My group must be one of the last hold-outs then, because we all started back in 94 (though not together). Although it looks like it's breaking up and until you get here, I'll see what UMBC has to offer with Az and Zadok and GauntletKing.

But still, in all those places, no one really questions the rules, at least not in the beginning. When you get comfortable with each other, I could see playing a wacky 5-Color game or no rares or whatever, but when you first come together, everyone knows that there's a Banned/Restricted List and you can only play 4 of a card and minimum 60 cards... what you seem to be talking about is more "variant" than rules.