BR Pain Discard

Discussion in 'Casual Decks/Variants/Etc' started by Terentius, Jan 26, 2015.

  1. Terentius The Instigator

    Doesn't seem like discard-focused decks are that popular... I still love them, and think it's one of the best ways to defeat most types of decks. I was waiting for Waste Not to come out in M15 to build this, though it isn't as good as I thought it would be.

    Creatures: 11
    3x Hellfire Mongrel
    2x Lavaborn Muse
    3x Blazing Specter
    2x Liliana's Reaver
    1x Nyxathid

    Enchantments: 2
    2x Painful Quandary

    Artifacts: 4
    4x The Rack

    Instants: 8
    4x Dark Ritual
    2x Terminate
    1x Agonizing Demise
    1x Hero's Downfall

    Sorceries: 15
    3x Blightning
    2x Despise
    2x Duress
    2x Thoughtseize
    2x Raven's Crime
    2x Wrench Mind
    2x Skull Rend

    Planeswalkers: 2
    2x Liliana Vess

    Lands: 18
    3x Rakdos Guildgate
    2x Rakdos Carnarium
    7x Swamp
    6x Mountain
    60 cards

    The deck is a "new Rack" of sorts, and Painful Quandary is the final noose. The difficult part is getting those initial critical discards in to cripple my opponents' start; keeping the pressure on is usually easy if that happens. I probably need to add more 1 drop discard spells. Hellfire Mongrel also does huge amounts of work in late game/multiplayer, but at the same time is awful when drawn at the wrong time.
  2. Mooseman Isengar Tussle

    Chain of Smog
    Cry of Contrition
  3. Terentius The Instigator

    Not lovin' the first two, but I could go for Cry of Contrition before a kill spell. Despise is good too; I think I actually opened one in a draft and forgot about it.
  4. Oversoul The Tentacled One

    I'm interested in testing Dark Deal for various combo purposes. It seems like it would certainly help out Waste Not. If you're using red, you could also throw in Burning Inquiry to really force some value out of Waste Not.
  5. Terentius The Instigator

    -1 Rakdos Guildgate
    -1 Mountian
    -1 Swamp
    +1 Despise
    +2 Rakdos Carnarium

    You just made me realize that I'm getting only minimal value out of Waste Not. I could for sure bet big on it, and pair it with multi-target whole-hand discard effects. If these discard effects, unlike a card like Skull Rend, are going also going to hit myself or my teammates, then I'd want to combine it with madness effects. Which is fine, because I was building a madness deck anyway! A Pain Discard/Madness deck might look like:

    Creatures: 10
    3x Brain Gorgers
    3x Gorgon Recluse
    3x Reckless Wurm
    1x Vengeful Pharaoh

    Enchantments: 8
    4x Liliana's Caress
    4x Waste Not

    Instants: 8
    4x Dark Ritual
    4x Dark Withering

    Sorceries: 14
    4x Burning Inquiry
    2x Call to the Netherworld
    3x Dark Deal
    2x Wheel of Fate
    3x Mindstab

    Planeswalkers: 3
    3x Tibalt, the Fiend-Blooded

    Lands: 17
    1x Rakdos Guildgate
    2x Rakdos Carnarium
    7x Swamp
    7x Mountain
    60 cards
  6. WickedBoy6 Captain of the Atog Army

    I have been a major, MAJOR fan of 8Rack when it comes to Modern, but I wouldn't suggest spending nearly $80 on a Liliana of the Veil. But, cards like Smallpox and Raven's Crime could be really good, and are under $0.50 each.

    Smallpox makes everyone lose a life, card in hand, creature, and land in play, and while you might think that's bad for you, you know it's coming, they don't, so you can plan ahead of time.

    Raven's Crime looks weak at one opponents-choice discard for B - while Wrench Mind and Hymn to Tourach are 2 discards for BB, which are also excellent cards, especially since Hymn is random - but Crime has Retrace, which can help continue to discard later in the game when you're just drawing unneeded land. Combos well with Dakmor Salvage, another extremely cheap card, in both price and utility. Dredge out Dakmor Salvage, get it back, Retrace Raven's Crime, rinse, repeat.
  7. Terentius The Instigator

    My main environment is kitchen table multiplayer Magic, and in these types of games I find it pretty difficult to bring one opponent, let alone multiple, down to 1 or less cards in hand. A lot of times it's difficult generating enough discard to get them low enough for Hellfire Mongrel or Lavaborn Muse, whose limit is 2.

    I do have another BW deck with Hymn, Hyp, Gerrard's Verdict, Ostracize, Duress, and Vindicate, but I don't play that deck as much because while it's good at controlling a single opponent, I often find it runs out of resources for multiplayer games. I think cards like Shrieking Affliction and Smallpox (I like Sinkhole too) are closer to that deck's style due to how much it can discard and how quickly, though obviously that deck isn't Modern. For the RB deck at the top, I'm really just wanting to cripple them by striking out key cards at the start, and then slowly build up more damage/life loss, or let Painful Quandary choke them out.
  8. WickedBoy6 Captain of the Atog Army

    Okay. Multi is still easy, in a way. Unnerve makes them all discards two cards for 3B, while Tasigur's Cruelty does the same at 5B, but does have Delve for possible value.

    However, the funnest card is Bite of the Black Rose. Everyone votes to either Infest - except you - or Unnerve. Either way, win-win.
  9. Terentius The Instigator

    Yeah, I'm diggin those too. Bite of the Black Rose sounds hilarious.

    What do you guys think about Mindstab? I wasn't playing when Time Spiral came out, but I don't hear much about Suspend cards being useful. Still, suspending this on the first turn seems like it would be really effective.
  10. WickedBoy6 Captain of the Atog Army

    The thing about Suspend cards is that people know when it's coming. They can plan ahead and react to whatever's being suspended, even holding onto countermagic or eliminating specific targets. Don't get me wrong, it can be fun, and depending on the card, really effective. In a multi-player game, you can probably hit someone with a Mondstab efficiently. The good thing is, you don't have to commit to the target when you suspend it, so you can pick and choose once the last time counter goes away.
  11. Mooseman Isengar Tussle

    I think the suspended mindstab can become a distraction to players in a multiplayer game and could siphon resources from your opponents as they plan and prepare for it to go off (even holding onto countermagic).
    It may also let you get a less frightening piece of your plan into play.
  12. Terentius The Instigator

    I threw it together somewhat on a whim, but that Pain Discard/Madness deck has been owning. With Liliana's Caress or Waste Not, Burning Inquiry/Dark Deal are huge playmakers. I saw a Standard variant of this deck on StarCityGames, but it was black blue and didn't seem nearly as strong. Could a variant of this deck be viable in Modern?

    For the regular Pain Discard:
    -1 Hellfire Mongrel
    +2 Lavaborn Muse - owns in multiplayer
    -3 Waste Not - I did some research and people have mixed feelings about it for discard decks since it came out last year. Because this performs so well in the Pain Discard/Madness deck, I'm okay with taking it out here, even though it was the main reason for starting the deck. Gives me more room for 1 drop targeted discard.
    -2 Geth's Grimoire - too slow
    +1 Dark Ritual
    +2 Bite of the Black Rose - I like this card but I'm not sure if I should
    +1 Despise
    +1 Necrogen Spellbomb - options are always good
    -1 Swamp

    I feel like this deck has the right cards now, but often it doesn't perform as well as I expect it to.
  13. Terentius The Instigator

    Testing out a Pain Discard build with The Rack replacing Liliana's Caress. So now the goal is more on quantity of discard:

    +1 Nyxathid
    +1 Hellfire Mongrel

    -4 Liliana's Caress
    +4 The Rack
    -3 Necrogen Spellbomb
    -1 Distress
    -1 Pain/Suffering - destroying a land with this is funny, but I need space
    -2 Bite of the Black Rose - after running this card for a while, I'm finding that the discard option is very unlikely to happen
    +2 Raven's Crime
    +2 Wrench Mind
    +1 Hero's Downfall/Dismember - which is better here?

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