Banned/Restricted List for Sept. 2008
- Thread starter Spiderman
- Start date
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DarthFerret
Guest
Whoa...I can put 4 Time Spirals in a deck leagally now? My opponents do not stand a chance...oh..wait...I guess I would have to have opponents first!
Oversoul
The Tentacled One
I don't know what to think about this. I thought the June changes to Vintage were extreme, but they seem tame compared to this. And I said those changes in June had made me lose interest in the format. They did. I haven't been following it at all. But this is just too fascinating not to pay attention to...
We get a big round of restrictions, and now a big round of unrestrictions. But I'm not even sure which ones will matter here...
Dream Halls has been restricted for a long time and is remembered as one of the most powerful enchantments ever. The very best card to use under Dream Halls is probably Time Spiral. And both are being unrestricted at the EXACT same time.
Chrome Mox and Mox Diamond are fast mana. And now they're both being unrestricted at the same time.
Personal Tutor seems like the weakest of the bunch, but it is still a tutor. Not having Brainstorm, Gush, or Ponder unrestricted will make it weaker, though. Still, it has potential.
Really, I don't even know. Both Moxes and Dream Halls are obviously powerful cards, but they're also card disadvantage. So this round of unrestrictions could to nothing to the format, or it could change it completely. And I'm not sure that anyone knows for sure. But this is huge. Probably bigger than the June changes.
It's crazy. I just might have to bring back my old Dream Halls deck...
It's kind of insignificant next to the other change. I kept thinking I was reading it incorrectly. They're strongly implying that Time Vault will have its ORIGINAL functionality restored. If that's the case, it's huge. It will make Time Vault go from a neat trick with Flame Fusillade (Edit: I should add that the current version disallows the Fusillade combo and it's possible that they're going to simply restore the erratum to the point where you can still untap it for free, but that wouldn't really be worth restricting the card and the wording seems to imply that this is bigger than that...) to the most powerful card in the game. Maybe you're not taking that last sentence seriously? You know how we talk about the "power nine"? Nine cards from the original core set that are extremely powerful and consequently the most valuable and feared cards in the game? Library of Alexandria became the honorary "tenth" power because it was printed in the first expansion set and was also quite powerful, making it also very expensive, although it's really not on par with the original power nine. Well, it would have originally been "power ten" if Time Vault hadn't been errata'd so early on. And that was back when there was no Voltaic Key or anything like that.
Time Vault with its erratum removed is BY FAR more powerful than other restricted cards. And I'm including Yawgmoth's Will in that, although I have to hesitate a bit on that one. I have an old InQuest issue where they made a list of the top 50 most powerful two-card comboes. Phyrexian Dreadnought + Illusionary Mask was their number one. Three mana and two cards for a 12/12 trampler. Time Vault + Voltaic Key is basically the same, but instead of putting out a big creature, it just wins.
My whole world is changing (well, the part that has to do with card games). For over a decade, I've known Black Lotus, Ancestral Recall, Time Walk, Timetwister, Mox Pearl, Mox Sapphire, Mox Jet, Mox Ruby, and Mox Emerald as the crown jewels of the game. The most powerful cards (you know, not counting Yawgmoth's Will, Tolarian Academy, and such--those cards are powerful precisely because they have the original power nine to fuel them). Now a card that was contemporary with these ancients, but was so powerful it had to be shackled with a great curse, is awakening from its slumber.
Soon if we say "power nine" or some variation on it (P9 or whatever), we're going to date ourselves...
We get a big round of restrictions, and now a big round of unrestrictions. But I'm not even sure which ones will matter here...
Dream Halls has been restricted for a long time and is remembered as one of the most powerful enchantments ever. The very best card to use under Dream Halls is probably Time Spiral. And both are being unrestricted at the EXACT same time.
Chrome Mox and Mox Diamond are fast mana. And now they're both being unrestricted at the same time.
Personal Tutor seems like the weakest of the bunch, but it is still a tutor. Not having Brainstorm, Gush, or Ponder unrestricted will make it weaker, though. Still, it has potential.
Really, I don't even know. Both Moxes and Dream Halls are obviously powerful cards, but they're also card disadvantage. So this round of unrestrictions could to nothing to the format, or it could change it completely. And I'm not sure that anyone knows for sure. But this is huge. Probably bigger than the June changes.
It's crazy. I just might have to bring back my old Dream Halls deck...
It's kind of insignificant next to the other change. I kept thinking I was reading it incorrectly. They're strongly implying that Time Vault will have its ORIGINAL functionality restored. If that's the case, it's huge. It will make Time Vault go from a neat trick with Flame Fusillade (Edit: I should add that the current version disallows the Fusillade combo and it's possible that they're going to simply restore the erratum to the point where you can still untap it for free, but that wouldn't really be worth restricting the card and the wording seems to imply that this is bigger than that...) to the most powerful card in the game. Maybe you're not taking that last sentence seriously? You know how we talk about the "power nine"? Nine cards from the original core set that are extremely powerful and consequently the most valuable and feared cards in the game? Library of Alexandria became the honorary "tenth" power because it was printed in the first expansion set and was also quite powerful, making it also very expensive, although it's really not on par with the original power nine. Well, it would have originally been "power ten" if Time Vault hadn't been errata'd so early on. And that was back when there was no Voltaic Key or anything like that.
Time Vault with its erratum removed is BY FAR more powerful than other restricted cards. And I'm including Yawgmoth's Will in that, although I have to hesitate a bit on that one. I have an old InQuest issue where they made a list of the top 50 most powerful two-card comboes. Phyrexian Dreadnought + Illusionary Mask was their number one. Three mana and two cards for a 12/12 trampler. Time Vault + Voltaic Key is basically the same, but instead of putting out a big creature, it just wins.
My whole world is changing (well, the part that has to do with card games). For over a decade, I've known Black Lotus, Ancestral Recall, Time Walk, Timetwister, Mox Pearl, Mox Sapphire, Mox Jet, Mox Ruby, and Mox Emerald as the crown jewels of the game. The most powerful cards (you know, not counting Yawgmoth's Will, Tolarian Academy, and such--those cards are powerful precisely because they have the original power nine to fuel them). Now a card that was contemporary with these ancients, but was so powerful it had to be shackled with a great curse, is awakening from its slumber.
Soon if we say "power nine" or some variation on it (P9 or whatever), we're going to date ourselves...
Guess we'll see on Friday why they're doing what they're doing...
Also, not sure if you saw this, but last month 13Nova placed in the top 8 in Vintage Worlds and he said the last set of restrictions didn't do a whole lot to the format (but then, he didn't go into much detail). Here's the thread
So hopefully he'll post back sometime about his experiences with this round of unrestrictions...
Also, not sure if you saw this, but last month 13Nova placed in the top 8 in Vintage Worlds and he said the last set of restrictions didn't do a whole lot to the format (but then, he didn't go into much detail). Here's the thread
So hopefully he'll post back sometime about his experiences with this round of unrestrictions...
Oversoul
The Tentacled One
Yeah, from what I've heard/read, the clock was slowed a bit (for the whole format) and a few decks were killed (Hulk Flash is an obvious one). I'm not sure that this one will be too different. The distinction is that because this is unrestrictions instead of restrictions, if one of these cards is more broken than anyone realized, it could make a huge impact. I don't know that any of them will be, though...
The explanation today
Oversoul
The Tentacled One
Well, everything there made sense. I'm testing Dream Halls right now. My build is pretty fast, but counterspells of any sort will be free for the opponents to play under Dream Halls, which poses problems for the deck.
The blurb about Time Vault didn't seem to tell us a single new thing, though. I'm interested in the decision to give that monster its teeth back after all these years...
The blurb about Time Vault didn't seem to tell us a single new thing, though. I'm interested in the decision to give that monster its teeth back after all these years...
Oversoul
The Tentacled One
Well, it's official. The most powerful card ever printed is back to its original functionality. It strikes me as not entirely useless on its own. You can drop it early, skip a turn, then take an extra turn when turns are more valuable. It won't usually work out that way, though. Depends on the matchup. More importantly, any spell that can untap an artifact once becomes a Time Walk, and any reusable effect that can untap an artifact wins the game.