If you play D&D.......

[arhar]

Read this only if you played AD&D First or Second edition, and enjoyed it.


I can't believe they're doing this to my first ever addiction. I'm 19, I have been playing for as long as I remember myself, and I still play every week.

I have only one complaint about 3rd edition.

Dwarven Necromancer-Paladin with no racial/class level limits?

Actually, it's more than one complaint. After reading a booklet about changes from 2nd to 3rd, I found, to my horror, that they are dumbing down the game. Yeah, I know, it sounds really cliche, but it's true. How can you have D&D without level limits? They had like 5 pages in DMG explaining why is this so important, and now they are just taking it out? Wow. I have a terrible feeling they are trying to make D&D appeal more to masses... but maybe I'm wrong? If there are any D&D players here, I'd like to hear your thoughts on that!

 

[Dark Horse]

Uhh yeah right. I havent bought 3rd edition yet, but that SUCKS!!!! First, in the PH, dwarves caant cast magic period. Second, what possible benifit is there to being human now. Pathetic. That is sad my friends. A true fall from grace.

 

[Almindhra]

Ok, I tried learning D&D 2nd...And it was too confusing for me (no, I'm not dummy)...Granted I didn't get to play it that much...But everything makes sense now...Its not dummied down...Please don't think that...Wizards has to appeal more to all the people who play D&D and not to the people they want to convert to play it anyways...

 

[Gamalon]

I had the unpleasureable task of trying to teach Almindhra to play 2nd Ed... but I can sympathize with both sidesm but I do like the new rules.

I, myself, am 20 and have been playing D&D since I was 12, I think, maybe 11. However I haven't had a character for the past 6 years, due to the lack of creativity on the parts of my PC's... so I have been DM'ing for what seems like forever.

I totally agree that a Dwarven - Mage/Monk/Paladin is absurd... but I would never allow something that far-fetched in my campaign. But, if it would liven up play I'd consider it... like a fumbling Dwarven mage trying to gain acceptence. But once again I'd limit it to only the best PC's I have... because I know they can pull it off.

But, look at the benefits: The new multi-classing rules, the ability to craft a chacter you really want with the Skills and Feats tables (I really like those), the evolution of charisma into a needed ability.

I don't think it is "dumbed down"... just easier, and more playable. As a DM I know that I won't have to worry about using high rolls, low rolls, d10's, d20's and the such. Now it's just: "a d20 + your modifier." Games will go by much more smoothly and sessions will have more accomplished (thus making the DM's job in finding and creating material more difficult -- which is a good thing)... so maybe some of my PC's will make it to the 3rd floor of Undermountain now (they always die in the same spot LOL).

However, there are some things I do not like: Attacks of opportunity, and the XP table sucks (they didn't really change the XP value of any monsters)!

Anyway, I rambled way too much... if you actually managed to get through this post let me know what you think.

 

[Spiderman]

I have no idea of what the 3rd edition rules say but I think y'all have been brainwashed by years of "sterotyping" for non-human races. I don't see why dwarves can't use magic, as long as there's some balancing factor involved. In fact, maybe there doesn't need to be one anyway. Just like why all GOOD thieves need to be halflings or something... or elves are the "greatest" spellcasters...

 

[Whimsical]

<seriously considers dusting off the ole' voodoo dolls and using 'em on the suppliers of this backwater country>

But before I go totally off-tangent from this thread...

A dwarven Necro/Paladin?! While I agree with mister Wallcrawler on the stereotyping of demi-human races (would that be considered racism? hmm...), I must protest on the fact that Necromancers and Paladins are two waaayyyyyy different concepts. Their paradigms don't even mesh! One dabbles in the dead and the other is goody-two-shoes who just happens to have one of the cheesiest magical weapons in the game short of an artifact.

<takes a deep breath>

Level limitations gone, you say? Hmm. The very idea of having character levels was what made Dungeons and Dragons ... well, Dungeons and Dragons. Admittedly it was a bit clunky and had a few weird quirks in it (like an 18th level fighter jumping off a 20 story building, land on his head, and still trash the red dragon), but you learned to adapt to the quirks (nowadays, you land on your head ... you die, period) and tailor it to your tastes.

D&D was always about heroes. About playing someone who could trash-talk an ancient red dragon and back it up with actions. It's about fast and furious melees on a truly epic scale (without the hassle of having to worry about having your spleen perforated by some schmoe of a peasant sneaking up behind you with a katana). Levels play a key part of that fantasy by letting the player experience the thrill of having an obscenely high level (or the agony of being level 2 and getting your heinie roasted by a pack of giggling kobolds).

I'll go a bit off-tangent here... GURPS, White Wolf, Paranoia, Amber, Falkenstein, Legend of the 5 Rings, Seventh Sea, as well as a whole wazoo of other RPGs ... none of them had levelling up.

Levels are a purely D&D thing. Uniquely so. You take that away ... and you've got just another RPG.

Whew. Now to go and see if 3rd Ed. is available here...

 

[Phyrexian Pie-Eater]

Ok people, this is my first major topic since i got back yesterday. I was at gencon in miluakee on the 10th for a few reasons;
1: Get some cards for my now awsome black and white deck.
2: Spend some time with my cuzins, both of whom i taught magic
3:Buy the 3rd edition hand book my DM demanded.

So after completing the first two, i got in line at the WoTC castle(you'd know if you've ever been there what I mean) and waited to get my book. About an hour later I get to the counter and got it.

I open it up expecting to see huge rule changes, and new classes, and a new race. And I did. But then I looked it over again, and saw that it isn't that much of a change.

Yes, they changed it to a new D20 system, but that was so that players aren't as limited in what they can do/have.

Yes, you can have a Dwarf Necro/Paladin/Druid/Bard/Fighter/Barbarian/Monk/Sorcer/whateverthehellyouwant but not without problems. you try role-playing some1 with that many personalities. the druid and barbarian parts team-up and beat the hell out of the spell casters, and the bard starts writing a song about the epic battle.

In the end I have this to say: Just because the book says to do it, doesn't mean you have to. You can play with the 2nd edition critical rules, or not alow a dwarf to be a caster. The great thing about ad&d as my friend the elf necro points out, is "hey man, your the dm, your god. you don't have to listen to no damn book. its all just suggestions in there."

Do what you want, not waht your told.

 

[Gamalon]

Actually a Dwarven - necromancer/paladin is impossible to have... since the paladin has to be lawful good still, and you try having a lawful good necromancer.

I hate that the DM's guide doesn't come out until next month, and the Monster Manual in October. WHERE ARE THE ADVENTURES!

 

[The Magic Jackal]

Yeah, it's Gamalon! Nice to see you here. You should post more often.

I have never played D&D. So I have no idea what you guys are talking about.

 

[Almindhra]

Yes!...You should post more often...!!..Cause you so smart...

 

[Cateran Overlord]

I've been playing for the better part of a decade now, but I haven't seen the rules yet. The way I see it, if I'm DMing I'll simply say "No, you cannot have a Dwarven Necro/Paladin/Druid/Bard/Fighter/Barbarian/Monk/Sorcer/whateverthehellyouwant because that makes no sense and I don't care if it says you can."

I do agree though, it does suck that the core books are coming one each month for a while, so when is the rest of it going to show up???

 

[Chaos Turtle]

I am a former compulsive D&D-er. I started with D&D basic, went to Expert, then Master rules.

Then I found AD&D.
The options!
The possibilties!

Then along came 2nd Edition.
Holy Smoke!

Now, along comes 3rd.
I'll grant that I don't have my copy of the PHB yet, but I have been keeping up with the news since this was first announced, and I am excited by what I've seen.
Excited!
I am already gathering together my old players to reintroduce them to the joys of roleplaying.

I have never liked level limits. I devised a way to get around them then (Character Class Codes, I could have written a book ) and I'm delighted that WotC has managed to see past the Tolkien-esque race stereotypes.

I can't f****** wait.

 

[krichaiushii]

Having gotten and read my copy of the new players handbook, there are a few things to note:

1. The rules have been generalized to cover whatever ideas players and DMs cook up. What is also stressed is that you should have plausible reasons for whatever odd combinations you find. The official world is Greyhawk, and I suspect that the old standard race and class breakdowns will be all that is regularly published. For more opinions and discussions on 3d Edition, go to http://www.webrpg.com and hie thee to the 3d Edition Forum. (And for the record, the card game forums there see about one post a year.)

2. The DM still has the final say over what goes on in the DM's world. That rule wasn't changed.

3. The Breakfast Club is on, and I am sufficiently distracted to forget my other points. I will repost once I remember.

That's all.

 

[Strahd Von Zarovich]

Yeah, I just got the 3rd ed. phb also. It's pretty nice, I think it's interface looks better. However I agree with the phyrexian pie eater that although it presents some options it would be ridiculous to take them all. I think it is probably best to just stick to 2 or 3 at most multiclasses. Also what does everyone think about removing the dual classing option for humans, it seems like this is just renamed presitge class but with a twist, you specialize as another class ,but you don't undertake a completly new class or so it seems. BTW, pie eater, how about a holy hand grenade pie creature?-bless this thy hand grenade,...and the people did feast on the ...., shall thou count to 3 no more no less.- eh eviikow, nudge nudge, nudge nudge, know what I mean, know what I mean. It really stinks though that the dm book isn't till september. there's no way to do all I wanted before school starts now. the mm book is interesting but not as important to have now I think as the dm . Personally I like a necro . If anyone knows btw, where to get out of print products for aol besides ebay and yahoo. Please let me know.
__________________
Strahd Von Zarovich

 

[Dark Horse]

I suppose maybe its ok, but im just gonna stick to 2nd edition. You can have a lawful good necromancer, it was the funnest character I ever played as a matter of fact. He reached level 14 before he died.

 

[Erbrich]

I have been playing D&D for about 5 years now. I started with 2nd Ed and when I first heard they were realeasing a 3rd, I wasn't too happy and my gaming group decided we would probably stick to 2nd Ed.
I was keeping up on the news and everything with 3rd ed and decided to buy the PHB when it came out. After the players in my group(I DM) rolled up characters and played one Adventure, they were all out buying their own PHB and I signed up on the WOTC site to be notified when the DMG is going to be released.
The rules are simplified--there were some things on the rules my group never really used because it was too much paperwork and firugring things out(encumbrance[within reason], proficiencies[checks], and sepll components to name a few). Now we use it all under the new rules. I like the BY CLASS spell lists and levels, the new skill system, the feats, the new initiative system, the new abiblity modifier system, and many other things about the game. It is a lot easier for the players to keep track of what is going on and for me to keep track of what is going on as the DM.
As for no racial restrictions and no benefits as a human, they have benefits as a human. Humans get bonus feats and skill points. They've also balanced out the classes through special abilities.
And as for multiclasing, you can't be a necro/paladin. Paladins, if they multiclass, can no longer follow the path of the paladin and essentially lose their holy path. ANd with any multi classing, if your highest and lowest classes are more that two levels apart(aside from you races favored class--Humans get a benefit here too), you get an experience penalty.
All in all, I like it and can't wait for the DMG. But it all comes back to what it's always been. THE BOOKS ARE A GUIDELINE. The DM is the final word on what goes and what doesn't. I won't allow players to multiclass unless they have a feasible way of learning the skills of the new class.

Erb