Tribal Dragons

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Gaea'sSaproling

Guest
Heres a deck I just made and I don't see much room for improvement, but if you have suggestions drop 'em to me ;)

Mana - 36
10 Mountains
4 City of Traitors
4 Sandstone Needle
4 Seething Song
4 Talisman of Indulgence
4 Thran Dynamo
1 Grim Monolith
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
1 Sol Ring
1 Voltaic Key

Dragons - 15
4 Covetous Dragon
4 Dragon Mage
4 Kilnmouth Dragon
3 Rorix, Bladewing

Sorceries - 5
4 Wildfire
1 Wheel of Fortune

Dragon Acceleration - 4
4 Urza's Incubator

and voila! Any suggestions are greatly appreciated, I was actually thinking about splashing black for Dark Rituals and Demonic Tutor, I don't know though.
 
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Gaea'sSaproling

Guest
oversoul since u and me seem to be the only ones awake any comments on the tribal piece?
 

Oversoul

The Tentacled One
Heh...

Well, I have never really considered dragon decks much of a threat (not Dragon decks, those are a threat, except to Train).

This one looks pretty finely tuned...

I think the other red deck you posted (still used Covetous Dragon, but not the other ones, which quite frankly are usually not as good).

I'm curious though, as to how good Kilnmouth has been for you. He received a lot of hype and I've never seen him live up to any of it...
 
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Gaea'sSaproling

Guest
he drops with counters about 85% of the time, and its aweomsly synergystic with wheel of fortunes and dragon mages since im always getting a full hand, i had a 18/18 kilnmouth drop the other day lol
 
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Captain Caveman

Guest
That looks pretty good. About the only thing I can think of would
be to replace 4 mountains with 4 Great Furnace, they could help
out with the Covetous draw-back.

My casual Dragon Tribal deck is Red, splash black, for Terminates
and Tutors. Your looks a little better than mine,.....probably..:)
 
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Gaea'sSaproling

Guest
wow thx... great compliment, great furnace could help a lil bit just incase theres a rare occasion i dont have a artifact out with covetous, it hasnt happened but its a good idea, give me a little more safty
 
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Gaea'sSaproling

Guest
i think i do have to much mana in this deck -.- i need to cut some sources, i dont know whats least useful tho, there all pretty damn good.
 

Oversoul

The Tentacled One
Voltaic Key is what I would cut to begin with. It is useless without a Dynamo or similar card, and doesn't provide all that much of a boost...
 
E

Exaulted_Leader

Guest
The best T2 deck I've ever built was a Dragon deck. It stomped the living crap out of T&N (...does T&N ever even see play outside of Block constructed? 'Cuz, it really sucks outside of block), gamed Goblins 50% of the time, and was (as with most things) far too slow to deal with Affinity.

Kilnmouth is, as far as mana-heavy fatties go, insane. 80-90% of the time he's a 4th turn drop with 12 or more counters, thanks to cards like Dragonspeaker Shaman and Seething Song (actually, when you think about what he does, he's reasonably priced. 5RR for a 5/5 flyer with Amplify 3 that taps to inflict damage to target creature or player for the number of counters on him. Just 4 other dragons in hand makes him a 17/17 airborne wrecking ball). He destroys you at instant speed just by TAPPING. That's nuts.


I'd put in some Dragonspeaker Shamans and replace the Covetous Dragon with Shivan Dragons. Rorix is too awesome. I had Magma Jet in my T2 deck... though I'm unsure of it's validity in just casual play (I was just using it to nuke Piledrivers and Hoverguards). What about removing some acceleration in favor of a few more Dragons and a playset of Sneak Attacks (...err, wait... I keep forgetting that not everyone has those... x.x)?
 
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Gaea'sSaproling

Guest
covetous is infinently better then shivan dragon because of the 1R also 7cc is achievable turn 2-3 usually, hmmm i was thinking about removing voltaic as ure right, if its the only thing u have then its a dead draw and doesnt do much help -.-

dragonspeakers dont survive wildfire...

lemme ask u this guys, rorix is a bomb no matter wut even though he is 3r, is having four of him to much?! especially since if an extra is in ure hand it fuels kilnmouth, and if he gets destroyed u always want to drop another and make it seem like u havnt missed a beat

i was considering shivan dragons but all my red mana is usually dedicated to other stuff
 
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Exaulted_Leader

Guest
True, Dragonspeakers don't survive Wildfire... but you need 6 mana before you can even blast one through. By that time, a Dragonspeaker should've help you kick-out a Dragon or two, and has served it's purpose.

Covetous dragon is not better than Shivan Dragon. There are very few flyers in the game that are better than Shivan Dragon. Shivvie will attack for a kill where Covetous won't. Drop a Shivvie turn four, attack turn five for 10. Attack turn six for the win. Can Covetous do that? Can Covetous survive so much as an oxidize or shatter 9 times out of ten?


Once the new Legend rule is in effect, and if your playing group abides by it, I'd switch to a full playset of Rorix. Until then, I'd be hesitant to include more than 3 of any Legend (Rorix included... though he's so good!)

Other dudes to maybe think about: Two-Headed Dragon and Dragon Tyrant. Two-Headed Dragon is a weird variation of a Shivan Dragon, while Dragon Tyrant is a drop with a rediculous mana cost that will always 'seal the deal' after it hits the table (Trample, Double-Strike AND Firebreathing!? How much damage does onecreature need to DO!? :p)
 
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Gaea'sSaproling

Guest
all mana intensive dragons that require mana to be better or stay alive dont make the cut, becasue after a wheel of fortune or dragonmage attack i spend all my mana dumping artifact mana and more dragons which gives me a few more threats each turn, the only ones i have tooken into consideration is shivan dragon, because of seething song, ill do some playtesting with it, but as far as i know for my deck all the dragon choices are optimal and only thing id need is another rorix lol ;) i love that card

and 10 times out of 10 a covetous will survive a oxidize ;)

dragonspeaker also costs RR which im usually spend R mana for mana acceleration and incubator works well with dynamo, vault, and monolith. wildfire comes out turn 3-4.

i was thinking about cards that fetch dragons from ure library that arnt creatures -.- any ideas for this?
 
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Tabasco

Guest
Where is Sneak Attack?

Cut the Wildfires and The Dynamos

Cut the Incubator too.

Cut the Dragon Magi they are more hurt than help.

Cut the 4 Needles for 4 Great Furnaces to help the Dragon out

Add in 4 Lightning Bolt

Add 2 Bladewing, The Risen

Add 2 Dragon Tyrant

Add 4 Sneak Attack

Add 4 Overmaster....it cantrips.....you said you liked drawing


Sooo...

-4 Wildfire
-4 Dynamos
-4 Dragon Mages
-4 Drza's Incubator
-4 Sandstone Needle

+2 Bladewing
+2 Dragon Tyrant
+4 Lightning Bolt
+4 Sneak Attack
+4 Overmaster.....or +3 Overmaster and +1 Winds of Change
+4 Great Furnace

Try That!
 
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Gaea'sSaproling

Guest
i like it... i actually thought about sneak attack its very good but... i would still keep wildfire and dragon mages to fuel more sneak attacking...

i have to get 4 sneak attacks before anything

id keep needles to

id probably just cut incubators for sneak attacks

and cut dynamos for tyrants and risen

cut 4 mountains for furnaces, which im going to do already no matter what direction i steer the deck in
 
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Reverend Love

Guest
I've been fiddling with the idea of using a Dragonstorm combined with the mana accelerators of:

Dark Ritual
Cabal Ritual
Seething Song

And maybe a Priest of Gix or two

Helps pay the big'ol cost of Dragonstorm and puts spells on the stack.

It's just and idea and I really haven't had time to flesh it out at all.

Use it, toss it, whatever.
 
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Gaea'sSaproling

Guest
I did some digging around the net earlier and found this gem of a deck which happens to be the 1999 World Champion piloted by Kai Budde. It has very similar to mine in the respects of the mana base, and I'm going to compare and contrast the rest of it.

Covetous Wildfire
4 Covetous Dragon
1 Karn, Silver Golem
3 Masticore
4 Cursed Scroll
4 Fire Diamond
4 Grim Monolith
2 Mishra's Helix
4 Temporal Aperture
4 Thran Dynamo
4 Voltaic Key
4 Wildfire
2 Worn Powerstone

3 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
13 Mountain

It runs 8 creautre threats, 8 cards for card advantage (Cursed Scroll and Temporal Apreture), it has 18 mana accelerators (Including Voltaic Keys), 20 Lands (Seven of which are faster then the norm), 13 Control elements (Wildfire, Masticore, Cursed Scroll), and the biggest difference is there are no RR or RRR costs while running 17R mana sources.

Now a comparison to my deck

Mana - 36
10 Mountains
4 City of Traitors
4 Sandstone Needle
4 Seething Song
4 Talisman of Indulgence
4 Thran Dynamo
1 Grim Monolith
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
1 Sol Ring

Dragons - 15
4 Covetous Dragon
4 Dragon Mage
4 Kilnmouth Dragon
3 Rorix, Bladewing

Sorceries - 5
4 Wildfire
1 Wheel of Fortune

Dragon Acceleration - 4
4 Urza's Incubator

I'm running 15 creatures threats, 5 card drawers which i believe are superior to kai's but not in the respect that 4 are delivered in creatures and in higher cost, 21 mana accelerants(including incubators), 19 Lands (I believe and know I can afford to run 19 because Talisman are better then Diamonds, im running 2 broken sources not in that deck ie mana crypt & lotus petal & i have 8 two mana producing lands, THIS is what saddens me.. only 4 control elements, my many base is truly terrible in some respects i have 12 2RR cards and 2RRR cards but I hardly make up with this because im only running 23 Red Sources...

My final conclusion is... I need to highly refine this deck to make it even a more tad competitive (even though its as casual as it gets), ive taken a super model of competitiveness and there are cards that can be afforded to be cut/switched in this deck

i believe the weakest card is in fact the urza's incubator and the strongest addition to the deck would be ancient tomb, but only a limited number not even 3 maybe 2

ive had way to much time on my hands...

wat to cut?! incubators are helpful... really helpful, but i dont see any other choices, id love to have 10 2 mana lands...
 
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Tabasco

Guest
Now...you forgot something about Kai's deck that makes it so good....

His Karn will make any of his artifacts creatures. Which is why his artifact mana producers are like a double-edged sword. They give him acceleratiopn and aggro.

Mishra's Helix is a 5/5 and Dynamo becomes a 4/4...all for 1 mana...his deck would run over yours like a freight train....

can your artifacts do that?

and technically he would have about the same amount of creature-like threats if he gets a Karn out.

His isn't really a dragon deck per say...his is more of a red control deck.

I don't mean to be rude or anything...

His deck is also better with the Covetous because of all the artifacts he runs. half of his deck is brown...and he is also sporting 4-ofs of some restricted cards...if you wanted to make his deck legal you would have 6 more cards choices to enhance it to your liking.
 
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