The 3 pile shuffle

Discussion in 'CPA Voting Forum' started by Landkiller, Jul 29, 2001.

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Is the 3 pile shuffle cheating?

Yes 0 vote(s) 0.0%
No 5 vote(s) 83.3%
Other 1 vote(s) 16.7%
  1. Landkiller CPA Menace

    Ok, I read about this on the Net in a few places.

    You take your opponent's deck, and pile shuffle using 3 piles. If your opponent has stacked their deck "spell, spell, land", this screws them.

    Is this cheating? I've heard it called cheating each time it was mentioned.

    However, it doesn't feel wrong to me...if your opponent was cheating, then they deserve it, and if not, it's a fair way to shuffle.

    BUT, If you really suspect they stacked their deck, you call a judge. Since, in this case, it seems likely that it is cheating to do a 3-pile.

    So, the idea of just doing that shuffle to each opponent, is that considered cheating? I've never done this in any sort of game, but it sounds fair enough.

    So many times, I know my opponents have tried to cheat me but I stop them. How many times do I never realize it and get screwed?

    I try to shuffle my own deck about 6-7 times b/w games, 10 b/w matches. I read somewhere you need to shuffle 7 times to achieve fairly complete randomness with a poker deck.
  2. Gizmo Composite: 1860

    It`s cheating because the only reason you would do it is to screw your opponent.

    It`s cheating because there are only two legal ways to shuffle, and that isn`t one of them.
  3. Lotus Mox New Member

    The reason this isn't a legal shuffle is that it does absolutely not randomize a deck, it's randomization factor lies by approx. 1 riffle shuffle.
  4. Landkiller CPA Menace

    ok, I haven't read the rules for the requirements for a legal shuffle, so I'll have to agree with you guys then.

    Well, if a deck isn't stacked, it shouldn't screw anyone, but, I guess the best thing to do is just shuffle the hell out of their deck so even if it was stacked it won't be anymore. Oh well.

    Actually, a lot of people I see do cheat, but in the way of "not knowing the operation of the cards, in a convienent way that always helps them out." So you always end up correcting them, and they never get busted. But 1 time, I was slacking and let someone Armadillo Cloak their Spectral Lynx. They just popped it on like it's the most natural thing in the world. In a constructed deck, you gotta know your own combo doesn't work! Didn't even realize it till I thought about playing vs. that deck again a couple weeks later. Also, sometimes people can't seem to add damage up right and end up a few life higher. That's the kinda stuff I catch mostly, but the actual physical manipulation of cards is something that, if it does happen, goes completely over my head. It's really hard to tell though, because sometimes people just are that lucky.
  5. Lotus Mox New Member

    I usually catch most of these things, but lately It often happened that my opponent plays a spell w/o having the right mana, like WoG w/ only 1 white or Dromar's Charm w/o black, that sort of stuff.
    I usually see these things but always way too late :(
  6. Hetemti The Wide-Awake Nightmare

    I don't mind pileshuffles if a deck is getting landclumps...often caused by poor shuffling ability...or sticky old cards...but only if it is riffle shuffled well afterwards, and if it's 7 piles...or 6 using a die to determine the sorting (which is a long method, btw)
  7. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    If your opponent has stacked his deck, wouldn't any type of shuffling "screw" up his plans? Influding riffle-shuffle? So why would you pile-shuffle anyway?

    The shuffling 7 times for a poker deck (or a 52 card deck in general) refers to riffle-shuffling, I believe, and is probably only effective if every card alternates.
  8. Zadok001 CPA Founder, Greater Good

    Spidey - If your opponent is stacking, chances are he used Land-Spell-Spell configuration. Pile shuffling a deck in LSS config with any multiple of 3 as the number of piles results in a deck that is completely clumped. A 60 card deck in LSS config that gets 3-pile shuffled will be 20 land, 40 spells. In that order. :) 6 piles, and you get 10 land, 20 spells, 10 land, 20 spells. Etc... Thus the taboo against that type of shuffling.

    [Ooops. I forgot to mention that a deck in LSS configuration can be pile shuffled in a number of piles that ISN'T a multiple of three, and RETAIN IT'S LSS CONFIGURATION. That means that if you "mana-weave" and then pile shuffle in anything that isn't a multiple of three, you end up with LSS configuration. --Zadok001]
  9. Mundungu grumpier than ever

    What are the two shuffling methods that Giz is speaking of ??

    Or, in other words, How should you shuffle to really get a good randomization ?
  10. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    Okay, I get it.

    Mundungu, I'm a firm believer in riffle-shuffling. If you do your best to alternate every card or every other, you should achieve a good randomization.
  11. Istanbul Sucker MCs call me sire.

    Pardon my ignorance, but...what IS riffle-shuffling?
  12. Spiderman CPA Man in Tights, Dopey Administrative Assistant

    I've always taken riffle-shuffling to mean the way people usually shuffle a regular deck of cards: divide it into two halves, slightly bend one of the short sides with your two thumbs, and put the short ends together by ideally "alternating" cards from each half. Then when the whole deck is back together again in a disorganized way, you push the halves together so they form a "bridge" and straighten into a neat deck.

    I hope I've been using it in the right context :)

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