OnBC: Goblins

R

Rakamir

Guest
If you can't beat Goblins, don't bother going to the PTQ's come August. They're strong, popular; they will be prevalent. If whatever you build can beat Goblins, or Gobbos, try the same deck vs Slide and see how you do.

Goblins in this block are fatter than Sligh builds you've seen in the past. Here is Jerrod Bright's more traditional Sligh-ish build:

OnBC Post-Scourge
GOBLINS
J. Bright
Deck is discussed here:
http://www.brainburst.com/db/print.asp?ID=3063

4 Goblin Goon
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Sledder
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Skirk Prospector
4 Sparksmith

4 Carbonize
4 Shock
4 Sulfuric Vortex

4 Forgotten Cave
4 Goblin Burrows
16 Mountain
Sideboard
3 Ark of Blight
4 Clickslither
4 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Sharpshooter

I'd change 8 main deck cards straight up, as well as the entire sideboard:
My Maindeck Changes:

-4 Sulfuric Vortex -4 Carbonize
+4 Clickslither +4 Gempalm Polluter

Do that, and you have a decklist similar to Tomi Walamies Pro Tour Venice Finalist deck, with two Mountains and two Menacing Ogres turning into 4 Goblin Warchiefs.

Why maindeck Clickslithers? To quote Jerrod:

"The Gempalm Incinerators and Clickslithers come in when playing against other beatdown decks, the Clickslither also helping against Astral Slide and other decks with plentiful mass removal." ..... Jerrod Bright, Legendary Aussie

In other words, approximately 100% of the field, so I think maindecking Slithers isn't all that risky.

NEW SIDEBOARD:
4 Stabilizer
4 Sulfuric Vortex
3 Rorix
4 Seige-Gang Commander

Not too worried about the board. Aggression hates boarding, anyway.
 
T

train

Guest
So you circle of Solace, and run foothills... along with other first strikers...

Then green for naturalize to get rid of slide - through disenchant...

Sounds like soldiers... would work well against both... or a strong Zombie deck - Infest, Festering, noxious, swat, smother, cruel revival, skinthinner, deathmark......

The zombies wouldn't be as strong against the slide though... but could deal with the angels if slide was dumb enough to tap out...
 
R

Rakamir

Guest
The first deck I built for Block was 10 weeks pre-Venice R/g Goblins with Foothills splashing Green for Naturalize. It beat my Slide deck (2nd one built ... as it lost practically nothing from Type 2 save Teroh's, the whole sideboard, and its natural enemies like wake and MBC), which was maindeck tuned to beat aggression. They matched up very well. The Naturalizes were boarded, however, and you could never be sure to draw them. My Goblins at the time were also main tuned to beat other Gobbos (I tend to do that with all my builds), yet still went 50/50 first game vs Slide.

3 of the Top 8 decks at Venice were Goblins, and one splashed Green. I like Tomi's, which didn't splash Green, the best. This was of course, pre-Scourge. Rumor has it Tomi wishes the maindeck Ogres had been Rorixes.
 
T

train

Guest
How did the one that splashed Green fare?...

And I'd run Naturalizes main...

If you wish to have a creature instead, Vigilante is not a bad fit... Sanctifier also fits in the White I mentioned... as do Demystify and Nova Cleric.
 
R

Rakamir

Guest
The R/g deck lost in the quarters to GW Veggetibitables (never could spell that word). It was this:

Gabriel Nassif
Goblins - Pro Tour Venice 2003 Quarterfinalist
Pre-Scourge

2 Forest
18 Mountain
4 Wooded Foothills

3 Clickslither
3 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Goon
3 Goblin Grappler
4 Skirk Prospector
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Sledder
2 Menacing Ogre
2 Rorix Bladewing
4 Sparksmith

3 Threaten

Sideboard:
3 Avarax
1 Blistering Firecat
4 Broodhatch Nantuko
2 Gratuitous Violence
1 Gempalm Incinerator
1 Nantuko Vigilante
3 Shock
 
T

train

Guest
lost in the quarters to GW Veggetibitables
Click to expand...
Hey... those colors are what I'm talking about running...;)

a little more tweaking and you never know...:cool:

My favorite win card against Psychatog was....


*drum rolling in background...*


...


Cease Fire... - They upheaval floating... and either counter the cease fire with the floating mana, in which case they don't play psych, or they just don't play psych, and take burn if no duress is available...;) :D
 
R

Rakamir

Guest
Things are firming up, and this is the list seen most often. Note that there are no Stabilizers in the board, the feeling being that a Slide opponent will take out stuff vs decks like gobbos that he expects Stabilizer to come in for, rendering Stabilizer moot. Also, most decks will have cycle lands and other cyclers, except train's.

Goblin Sharpshooters replace boarded Stabilizers, and I always liked those. They come in handy if you're "Wrathed."

4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Skirk Prospector
4 Goblin Sledder
4 Goblin Goon
4 Sparksmith
4 Clickslither
4 Shock
4 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Burrows
4 Forgotten Cave
16 Mountain

SB:

4 Goblin Sharpshooter
3 Rorix Bladewing
4 Sulfuric Vortex
4 Siege-Gang Commander

Listed and explanations by Wade Wojcak from his TOGIT.com artcle of June 3

http://www.togit.com/reports/WW_CCJune03Week1.html
 
T

train

Guest
Goblin Sharpshooters replace boarded Stabilizers, and I always liked those. They come in handy if you're "Wrathed."
Click to expand...
unless there's something I'm missing, any mass removal gets rid of the sharpshooter too, so he's of no use then...
 
R

Rakamir

Guest
You control the order in which your critters go to the boneyard.

Making sure you put Sharpshooter there last, you tap/untap/ping with Sharpshooter for each creature that goes there. Seige-Gang Commander never looked so good. :)
 
L

Lotus Mox

Guest
Originally posted by Rakamir
You control the order in which your critters go to the boneyard.

Making sure you put Sharpshooter there last, you tap/untap/ping with Sharpshooter for each creature that goes there. Seige-Gang Commander never looked so good. :)
Click to expand...
you can control the order of creatures going to the gy, but you can't play abilities while they do ;), so all the Sharpshooter untapping is useless, because no Sharpshooter will be in play to untap.
Of course things look diferently if you have Goblin Sledder in play...
 
R

Rakamir

Guest
From the Onslaught FAQ (still disagree?):

Goblin Sharpshooter
R2
Creature -- Goblin
1/1
Goblin Sharpshooter doesn't untap during your untap step.
Whenever a creature is put into a graveyard from play, untap Goblin Sharpshooter.
T: Goblin Sharpshooter deals 1 damage to target creature or player.

* If several creatures are put into the graveyard at once, Goblin Sharpshooter's ability will trigger once for each creature. Since you get priority after each of these effects resolves, the Sharpshooter has the potential to deal 1 damage for each time it untaps.
 
L

Lotus Mox

Guest
Originally posted by Rakamir
From the Onslaught FAQ (still disagree?):

Goblin Sharpshooter
R2
Creature -- Goblin
1/1
Goblin Sharpshooter doesn't untap during your untap step.
Whenever a creature is put into a graveyard from play, untap Goblin Sharpshooter.
T: Goblin Sharpshooter deals 1 damage to target creature or player.

* If several creatures are put into the graveyard at once, Goblin Sharpshooter's ability will trigger once for each creature. Since you get priority after each of these effects resolves, the Sharpshooter has the potential to deal 1 damage for each time it untaps.
Click to expand...
I never disagreed with what the FAQ said, note that it doesn't mention the Sharpshooter going to the gy along with the other creatures. :)
 
S

Spiderman

Administrator
Staff member
That is true. If the Sharpshooter is going to the graveyard along with everyone else, his ability will trigger that many time but he will no longer be around when it's time for them to resolve (for him to untap).
 
R

Rakamir

Guest
You're right of course. My pocket rules lawyer buddy explained it thus, but before I give his explanation, I would like to protest all the Sligh players who top 8'd at States with an imperfect understanding/application of Sharpshooter, especially if the misunderstanding was intentional. I hate when that happens. Thanks for clearing up my bad confusion. My pocket pal, Nave the Level One Judge, writes:

"You are incorrect Rakamir. Well, not entirely, but for the purposes of your question.

"When someone wraths it puts a "everything dies" effect on the stack. When wrath resolves, everything dies. You can choose the order that your creatures go to the graveyard, but they all die simultaneously. So for purposes of Nether Shadow, or your opponents Phyrexian Furnace, you have control. You can't do things "on their way" as this would be doing something mid-effect, which is a big no-no. So yes, you choose the order, but it doesn't matter the way you thought.

"Additionally, the game checks the state before the wrath resolved for any effects to trigger. This is why Rotlung provides zombies for all the clerics that went to the graveyard, or why Lifeline returns all creatures to play when someone wraths. So you should have a bunch of "untap me" effects on the stack after the wrath... but since the sharpshooter is gone they won't do anything really."

Like Spiderman said. :)
 
R

Rakamir

Guest
You mean we have our own Rune Horvik? Cool. :)

Btw, what do you folks think about how many Sulfuric Vortex should be included in the main deck? Having four spread between main and board seems like a great idea, considering folks seem to be concentrating on the more controllish builds of late.

But how many main? The choices seem to be 0, 2, or 4. I vote zero, personally, for several reasons, but mainly because I want the first game to be as aggro as possible, and Vortex doesn't really affect board position, if you think about it. (Kicks butt out of life totals tho, especially in multiples).
 
E

EricBess

Guest
Well, I don't know that I've been compared to Rune before, but I'm flattered. I only occasionally read through the decks forum, and then only to skim, especially with so many new OnBC decks being posted recently (I have to budget my time). I'll usually get to the Rules forum same day, though (except on weekends, when I don't always get online).


Concerning your non-rule issue, I think the Vortexes can be included in an agro deck very nicely. One of the standard issues with Sligh is that it eventually runs out of steam. Vortex is just one way to keep the pressure on. I don't know that I would run 4, but I wouldn't automatically say 0 just because it doesn't seem agressive. After all, how often do you get your opponent down to 4 life, only to have them finally get control and mount a comeback. Vortex is a new type of threat and forces them to think of Enchantment damage as well.

Oh, and you're right, it doesn't affect board position. But Sligh only cares about board position early. If it gets to mid game, you've already lost....Unless you drop a Vortex :D
 
R

Reverend Love

Guest
Try running Mana Echos with goblins. My teammate ran something like this at regionals and crushed everything he played (He's now going to the Tournament in San Diego...forgot it's title...but I know you need an invite).

Mana Echos
War Break Trumpeter
Firecat Blitz
Blaze
Goblin Matron
Raging Goblins
more goblins


With Echo's on the table he had LOTS of options. He can flip a trumpeter for a crapple load of goblins, then in turn pump a firecat blitz..then blaze you even further into the negative life totals. People don't expect to see 70+ (the highest I've seen him do was 157) fire kitties coming at them...go ahead Astral Slide away.
 
N

Nightstalkers

Guest
always thought goblins just overran you... ever try the same with over powered Elves? what a thought that is
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top