Ethics of Discussion

D

DÛke

Guest
Sadly, I find it rather disappointing that the only way people around here, or most of them, can discuss things is by "agreeing," "disagreeing," or "agreeing to disagreeing."

It is childish, immature, and leaves much to be desired.

So yes, I have a problem with CPA members. A big one. They need to learn how to discuss things. It's not that hard guys, and you'd think basic education would have taught that. Instead, we get someone who simply awaits the next few points another makes, dissects them, destroys them, or simply just insults the person, and says "you're wrong," in the meantime offering little or no real effort to give their opinion or make up their own theories and ideas. It's very unproductive, to be frank, and leads nowhere.

Something can't be "wrong," or at least can't be said "to be wrong," if the person saying that it is "wrong" can't offer what is "right," other than just a "gut feeling" or whatever. And yet that's the case. "You're wrong." That's all you hear, whether they actually say just that or right a 20 page essay. The conclusion is "you're wrong." But why? "Because you're wrong." So can you show me what is right? "You're wrong." So what's right? "You're wrong." Any ideas, please, of what's right? "You're wrong."

The CPA was never like this, certainly it wasn't a year or so ago. Now it is. Sigh.
 
M

Mikeymike

Guest
I've noticed that discussions can carry out in quite a civil manner, until someone drops a land-mine. You know, that comment which turns a discussion from a healthy debate to an out-right argument. And once it has reached argument mode, it becomes very difficult to pull it back out.

I also don't think many listen enough to what others are saying, instead just waiting for their turn to talk/strike. Though this is often a by-product of argument.

The personal vendettas that seem to be running rampant don't help matters much either.
 
D

DÛke

Guest
It is sad for me. And I agree with you about the personal vendettas Mike.

Houts, against the CPA, in a sort. Istanbul vs Gizmo. CasualOblivion against me. Sigh. Where's Almindhra when you want her...
 

Spiderman

Administrator
Staff member
DUke[/quote said:
Sadly, I find it rather disappointing that the only way people around here, or most of them, can discuss things is by "agreeing," "disagreeing," or "agreeing to disagreeing."
Usually that point is reached once everyone has had their say and there is nothing left to say.

Sometimes there aren't any true "wrongs" or "rights". Just like the casual discussion, everyone has their own view and spin on subjects. And unless the discussion is about something that can be backed up with facts (remember those? :) ), a person is usually not going to change another's mind.

This happens anytime there's a "subjective" subject, from politics to religion to Magic theory.
 
T

TheCasualOblivion

Guest
Don't really have a vendetta against DUke. I just think he's more than a little full of himself, takes this game, and definitely this board way too seriously, and tends to be a jerk, insulting and being condescending to others from time to time.
 
D

DÛke

Guest
But like see...

If someone is willing to give out a theory, it can't be just dissected or called "wrong" on very vague and personal bases, without really sharing why the theory or point of view wasn't "good enough."

I have no problem with everyone offering their own point of view.

In fact, Spiderman, that's what I want! It's the lack of these point of views that upsets me. People who have no point of view and refuse for everyone else to have a point of view by marking "wrong" anything and everything that does try to have a point of view. Do you know what I mean?

Oh, and I don't take this board seriously. I take people in it seriously, as I see fit. It's called "respect."
 

Spiderman

Administrator
Staff member
I think initially people DO offer their views. It's more after that when they don't follow up to re-explain or move to the dissecting of other views that you mention.

Which again is hard to remember with the casual thread. I mean, 180+ posts is a lot to remember and things will inevitable get bogged down.
 
T

TheCasualOblivion

Guest
It doesn't help either when people take the superior "holier than thou" attitude either.
 
D

DÛke

Guest
That's all in your head. Some people might claim Gizmo to be one of these people, I disagree. I treat him and look at him as anyone else. Same with Istanbul. Spiderman. Whoever. Some people might claim I am one of those "holier than thou" people, but that's all on them, not me.

<lol at Killer Joe. :)>
 
T

TheCasualOblivion

Guest
I have only seen HOUTS exceed you in arrogance on this board, DUke. I've argued with Gizmo before and he isn't nearly as bad as you.

You like to argue, and you put a lot of effort into it. Let me give you a bit of advice, and tell you that arguing in a manner that makes people perceive you as a jerk is a great way to get ignored, and I'm sure you can't bear that. Being ignored isn't an effective way to argue.

Or maybe you just file people who ignore you because you're arrogant under "Idiots" with the rest of us.
 
D

DÛke

Guest
I wish you of all people would ignore me, and I say that as sincerely and without attempting to come off as a jerk. You and I just don't get along, our views are so different; and although I enjoy such difference (history with Almindhra as well as other members proves that), because I think it can be stimulating and productive, it requires both sides to be open and willing. You are closed - you don't discuss, you shut down the other person; maybe you have no opinions, but that, more than anything, gives you a reason to not shut down an other person's opinion because you have nothing to offer.

For example. You asked what is a casual player. You had no, and still have, no theory about it. I gave a theory. Instead of anything, you just tell me you think that it's not really that good beacause more people need to be included under "casual." Why, you don't say. When, in fact, I offer the Hows and Whys, you offer me nothing. Hence, talking to you is very unproductive task that leaves the mind thirsting for an outlet. And if you would ignore me, I would be relieved rather than offended. I am offended by your Private Message, I am offended by how you mistreat my intentions, and I am offended by the manner in which you argue. Opposition, in this case, is negative, and not positive, and we should both try to avoid it when it comes to one another.

You disagree with a lot. That's good. What's pathetic is how you offer no reasons whatsoever other than "it's not that way" or "it's just not like that." You offer no real reasons or any alternatives. Which leads us to one of two points: either you have an opinion which you're not sharing, or have nothing and are afraid that others may be more right than you are. I've conceded to few of your points, in hopes that build a more solid foundation between us, but that doesn't work. You think many things are wrong, without giving any insight as to what may be right. Did you not ever write a term paper?

I, on the other hand, don't shut down a person. I listen to him or her, offer clear reasons as to why I think they are wrong or right. From what I understand, that's how a productive discussion is. And by far, you disappoint in that regard. That said, you are more unhealthy for the intents of a discussion than HOUTS, Gizmo, Istanbul, Almindhra, FoR, Apollo and...basically, everyone I have known in the CPA hitherto. That is saying a lot.
 
T

TheCasualOblivion

Guest
You make the statement "I disagree with you and you're being a jerk about it" sound so complicated. Gee, I just noticed that statement kind of applies to both of us.

I believe I started the what is a casual player thread with a theory. Granted this theory wasn't as well thought through or well written as your big post, but I was just starting things off, and didn't really put much into it at the time.

As for not being a contribution to discussion on this site: I give you the following threads:

Question about Tribe decks
TheCasualOblivion 12-31-2004 08:38 AM
by Oversoul 18 150 Casual Decks/Variants/Etc

Raging Goblin Sucks ( 1 2 )
TheCasualOblivion 01-18-2005 09:17 AM
by Ferret 34 297 Battle Arena

definition of casual ( 1 2 )
TheCasualOblivion 01-18-2005 11:06 AM
by Killer Joe 26 205 General CPA Stuff

Why the Elf hate?? ( 1 2 )
TheCasualOblivion 01-22-2005 03:13 PM
by TheCasualOblivion 29 224 General CPA Stuff

Does anyone even buy the basic sets anymore ( 1 2 )
TheCasualOblivion 01-25-2005 07:03 AM
by Spiderman 39 368 General CPA Stuff

Official Mirrodin Hate Topic ( 1 2 3 )
TheCasualOblivion 01-30-2005 09:39 PM
by Mikeymike 43 451 General CPA Stuff

Blue is bad in multiplayer ( 1 2 3 )
TheCasualOblivion 02-01-2005 06:35 AM
by Spiderman 46 470 General CPA Stuff

Abuse of Ninja ( 1 2 )
TheCasualOblivion 02-02-2005 10:15 AM
by Spiderman 34 451 Casual Decks/Variants/Etc

BOK: Cycle of Shoals ( 1 2 )
TheCasualOblivion 02-10-2005 10:32 AM
by Mikeymike 20 243 General CPA Stuff

Absolutely insane Ninja idea!!
TheCasualOblivion 02-11-2005 02:00 PM
by DÛke 18 161 Casual Decks/Variants/Etc

What is a casual aggro deck? ( 1 2 )
TheCasualOblivion 02-14-2005 06:25 AM
by Spiderman 23 203 General CPA Stuff

Old cards: Powerful, or Broken? ( 1 2 3 4 )
TheCasualOblivion 02-14-2005 11:42 AM
by Spiderman 73 879 General CPA Stuff

I built this Ninja deck and it seems to work... ( 1 2 )
TheCasualOblivion 02-20-2005 10:00 AM
by Limited 24 178 Casual Decks/Variants/Etc

The question of questions: What is casual? ( 1 2 3 4 5 ... Last Page )
TheCasualOblivion Today 05:04 PM
by DÛke 181 1,535 General CPA Stuff


You will notice that I began(some might say provoked in some cases) each one of these discussions. You might remember that this is basically the majority of the discussions that have occurred here, and I participated heavily in all of them.

Notepad said I have a sort of Jerry Springer style to things, so be it. The discussions would be a lot quieter and more infrequent if I wasn't here.
 
D

DÛke

Guest
You start threads. Big woof. Your quality of contribution is embarrassing to those threads. I can ask a million questions. Why don't I? I have nothing to say about them and can't argue much should someone says something about them. I don't post for the sake of appearances.

And for god's sake, I don't want to see your freakin CPA resume; all things considered, you're new here. With me, Gizmo, Istanbul, HOUTS, and an array of other posters that have presence here to keep things hot and on the edge, you're just another member, like us, so enough with the "but this place needs me!" horse load. Humkay?

You're more of a spammer than anything else. Albeit, you reinvent spamming, to your credit, but a spammer nonetheless. At least train and Nightstalkers have an honest, dedicated, stylish method of spamming, whereas you're all pretense. I never thought I would see a day in which calling someone a "second-rate spammer" would happen, but that's you: a second-rate spammer.
 
T

TheCasualOblivion

Guest
I wasn't aware I cared enough to have "pretense"

This is a message board. I come here to relax and talk about stuff. I'm not getting paid for it, and I'm not doing it for a grade. This is also not my social life. Excuse me if I don't take it that seriously.

I don't see anyone else starting threads here..
 
D

DÛke

Guest
It's because everyone else is busy realizing how such a waste of time it is to reply to your questions.
 
M

Mr_Pestilence

Guest
Not to go all political on you, but this is indicative of what is happening to society at large.

People want to believe what they want to believe, and are incapable of considering the opinions of others.

About the worse thing you can call a politician these days is "moderate". The very idea of seeking common ground with people you disagree with is viewed as a sign of weakness, and won't be tolerated by your "allies".

The order of the day is to lower your shoulder, knock your opponent to the ground, and stomp him and his differing ideas into dust.

The art of debate, or even polite, genuine discussion is deader than "compassionate conservatism".
 
Top