Can you Remove Soul a morph creature played face down?

Discussion in 'Rules Questions' started by Sammy Dead-O, Feb 7, 2003.

  1. Sammy Dead-O wasting away again

    Subject says it all. I know this is a very, VERY basic question, but I want to make sure it is treated as a creature spell when played face down. My guess is that you can counter it...

    While we're at it, you can counter a spell played with Madness, can't you?
  2. Jigglypuff Big Cute Pink Thing

    Yes and yes. Note that you can't Remove Soul a morph creature when it is turned face-up.

    (- Steve -)
  3. Nightstalkers Creature — Nightstalker

    flippin it up is considered an ability aint it?

    and how does double strike work??
  4. Jigglypuff Big Cute Pink Thing

    Yes. Paying the morph cost and then flipping it face-up is an ability.

    This is double-strike:

    502.28 Double Strike

    502.28a Double strike is a static ability that modifies the rules for the combat damage step.

    502.28b During the combat damage step, if at least one attacking or blocking creature has double strike or first strike, creatures without double strike or first strike (see rule 502.2) don't assign combat damage. Instead of proceeding to end of combat, the phase gets a second combat damage step to handle the remaining creatures. Creatures with double strike also assign combat damage during the second combat damage step.

    502.28c Removing double strike from a creature during the first combat damage step will stop it from assigning combat damage in the second combat damage step.

    502.28d Giving double strike to a creature after combat damage has been put onto the stack in the first combat damage step will allow the creature to assign combat damage in the second combat damage step, even if it already assigned combat damage in the first combat damage step.

    502.28e Multiple instances of double strike on the same creature are redundant.

    (- Steve -)
  5. train The Wildcard!!!...

    I love that redundant word...

    It's like 2 level 1 hopefuls judging FNM... redundant, especially when there's a level 2 present... everyone always wants the answer from the highest judge available anyway...
  6. kriz_riktr Member

    That is incorrect. Paying the Morph cost and turning a face down Morph card in play face up is ending an effect, it is not an ability.
  7. Jigglypuff Big Cute Pink Thing

    Dang it. Guess I better brush up on the Morph rules before I forget to take my judge test.

    (- Steve -)
  8. BigBlue Magic Jones

    So, you could morph a creature which had been humbled...

    And if it was white with a crusade in play it would be a . . .?
  9. train The Wildcard!!!...

    Doesn't it have to have the ability before you can end the effect though... so you're playing it's ability to end the effect?...

    What happens when your morph sits there while a humility comes into play and you're tapped out...

  10. EricBess Active Member

    The morph effect is still on the creature, so you can still pay to turn it face up. It will be a 1/1 with no abilities when it is face up.

    If it is white and there is a Crusade in play, then it is just like all other white creatures, it depends on which has the later timestamp, the humility or the Crusade.
  11. train The Wildcard!!!...

    Okay, but doesn't it have to have the ability before you can end the effect... or am I just completely lost...

    I'm used to the latter on very detailed specifics...:rolleyes:
  12. kriz_riktr Member

    No, the Morph ability is a static ability that applies to a card when it is in your hand.

    Remember Lost in Thought from Judgment:

    Lost in Thought
    Enchant Creature
    Enchanted creature can't attack or block and its activated abilities can't be played. Its controller may remove three cards in his or her graveyard from the game to ignore this ability until end of turn.

    When the controller of the enchanted creature removes three cards from his library to temporarily end the effect of Lost in Thought he is not playing an ability. He is just paying a cost to end an effect. Morph is similar.

    When you play a Morph creature face down on the stack a continuous effect is created. Part of this continuous effect is that this creature will remain face down until you pay the Morph cost. Paying that cost isn't another ability, it is just the final part of the continuous effect.
  13. Nightstalkers Creature — Nightstalker

    wow... thats in depth.

    thnx for the cont. effect of morph kritz

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