Anyone else happy to see gold cards will continue beyond Apocalypse?

M

MumboJumbo

Guest
There's no way to be sure gold cards will be printed in Odyssey and its expansions. But I suspect they will be based on the card John Finkel submitted for the Vendetta expansion. His original card, Wrath of Leknif, was a "better than Wrath of God" Wrath of God, so R&D made him submit a new card, which is:

Dark Elfkin
1UB
2/3
Whenever Dark Elfkin deals combat damage to an opponent, you draw a card.

plus EITHER

U: Dark Elfkin can't be the target of spells or abilities.
B: Dark Elfkin can't be blocked except by black creatures and artifact creatures.

OR

Dark Elfkin can't be blocked except by black creatures and artifact creatures.

Personally, I'm rather ambivalent about the card itself, but I was very happy to see that he submitted another gold card. I suspect R&D would have asked him to resubmit a non-gold card if there were to be no gold cards in Odyssey and its expansions.

The small number of Tempest/Stronghold gold cards aside, Weatherlight through Prophecy was a long stretch to go without gold cards, and while I'm sure post-Apocalypse expansions will have significantly fewer gold cards than the Invasion cycle expansions, it's nice to know they'll continue.

MumboJumbo
 
M

Major Crime

Guest
As long as they want to see 2 & 3 colour decks they will do gold. They may have to lower the number in each set, the last couple have been gold heavy.
 
S

superguy

Guest
I'm happy. I like gold cards, and I am real excited about Apocalypse. Don't wanna see them go :)
 
D

Duel

Guest
I dunno, I like the good ones, but they seem excessive right now, no? Like they're using gold cards just to have gold cards.
 
S

Sammy Dead-O

Guest
It'd be nice to see the gold continue, although I wouldn't count on Finkel's card as a definite indication. If I'm not mistaken, Pikula's submission was originally blue, and R&D made it gold.

I think there will be some, however, and I look forward to it.
 
C

Chaos Turtle

Guest
...but I hope that they not have quite so many as they have had in Invasion block.
 
D

Duel

Guest
Yeah. Keep the effective gold cards, whose drawback is restricting you to colors (recoil, terminate, etc.) but get rid of ones that are just there for "cycles" or balance (daring leap? why?)
 
C

Cateran Emperor

Guest
Aye indeed. Let's make gold cards part of every set, not the focus of a whole block.

Gold Spells that should stick around:
All of the bears
Terminate
Recoil
Countermagic (why rare, WHY???)

Gold Spells that are excessive:
Plague Spores
Frenzied Tilling
Daring Leap

And so on. Gold permanents are the best of all though.
 
L

Lotus Mox

Guest
Actually they always had gold cards that were just chaff, gold cards have the same chaff ratio as all other cards.

I don't like them anyway, they're limiting the card combinations you can play (anyone else has that preconstructed feel in IBC? ).
e.g. if you want to play a Vile Consumption/Overabundance deck you can't realistically play it because 2 cards are requiring 4 colors which aren't easy to get, if all cards were mono-color you can combine them much better. Magic deckbuilding is after all nothing else than combining 60 cards into 1 deck, and I don't like getting limited that way :( .

Bottom line:
I want mono-color cards back! (and Jaya Ballard but that's besides the point)

HOipa!
 
M

MumboJumbo

Guest
Maybe it's just me, but I think some of you are missing the point of gold cards. Gold cards are either cards that wouldn't exist as mono-color cards, or are cards that combine the themes of several colors into one card. It's clear that John Finkel would like his Dark Elfkin card to have the "fear" ability (creature is only blockable by artifact or black creatures.) That's not a blue ability, yet Duel states he wants the card to be mono-blue. They'd surely strip the "fear" ability if they made it mono-blue, and you'd be left with a 2/3 that could be made untargetable. Anyone else think that's hardly exciting or interesting?

Lotus Mox complained that he can't make a Vile Consumption/Overabundance deck because of the 4 colors involved. No, that would never be a tournament deck, but building such a deck with a good green base would be possible. I'd also like to point out that both Vile Consumption and Overabundace wouldn't even exist as cards if they were supposed to be mono-colored. They both combine abilities of two colors, and I'd argue that both cards would be out of flavor as mono-colored cards (I used to grumble about how WotC shouldn't worry about making cards out of flavor for a color, but now I see why it's such a strong point of the game design.) Does anyone really think Absorb or Undermine should have been mono-blue?

Lotus Mox was right about the chaff ratio on gold cards. To be balanced, a set would need to contain the same number of cards for each color combination. That's going to result in some clutter, but how is that different from single color cards? There are lousy mono-colored cards, lousy artifacts, lousy lands. Why no lousy gold cards? I think they did an outstanding job with the power level of gold cards in Invasion/Planeshift. For every Darking Leap there's a Terminate. If they attempt to make every gold card "good", there'd inevitably still be gold cards at the lower end of the power spectrum that would be considered garbage.

I'd really like to see gold cards continue as a significant part of each set. I don't expect to see as many as Invasion or Planeshift, but I never saw the point of Tempest's 10 gold cards, either.

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I

Istanbul

Guest
Gold cards provide the ability to combine effects that wouldn't normally be seen together into one card.

Frenzied Tilling (3GR) = Stone Rain (2R) + Rampant Growth (1G)
Plague Spores = Stone Rain (2R) + Dark Banishing (2B)
Absorb = Counterspell (UU) + Healing Salve (W)

You get the point.

Well, why isn't Frenzied Tilling red? Red doesn't fish into its library for cards.
Why isn't Plague Spores red? Red doesn't really do Terror effects.
Why isn't Absorb blue? Blue doesn't really gain life.

At any rate, there should always be gold cards; cards that reward a player for splashing into a second color with effects their first color couldn't normally produce. I think they HAVE been a little excessive lately, though. Gold cards really shouldn't ever be more than 1/10th of a set.
 
D

Duel

Guest
Actually, I think historically and realistically, gold cards have a higher chaff-to-charm ratio than mono color because they're usually more specialized,less generally useful. The generally useful gold cards should stay.
 
R

Ransac

CPA Trash Man
I love the fact that they brought back Gold cards. It's going to be kind of wierd for me when Odyssey comes in, though. I've played Magic for years, but this will be the first time I have played with a Cycle for almost a full two years in tournament play (Masques) and not be able to with it later. I mean, even now, Invasion seems like a brand new set and soon, it's going to be the oldest set in Type 2. It just feels wierd.



Ransac, cpa trash man
 
I

Istanbul

Guest
Heck, I'll be glad when Mercadian block leaves. Type II is insanely stagnant; the loss of Counter-Rebel as a possible deckstyle will open up whole other avenues of exploration. We'll also lose such perfectly balanced cards as Parallax Wave, Blastoderm, and other irritating cards that are simply way too good. I said it when Nemesis came out: "Whenever you have a mechanic that allows people to play cards for less than they normally would, you have to be VERY CAREFUL what you do with it." Nemesis wasn't as bad as Tempest block or the Tolarian decks as far as speed goes, but it WAS chock-full of very powerful cards with Fading, ones that didn't NEED to be in play for wrong. Saproling Burst, anyone? Prophecy was a failure because the sacland and tapout mechanics were, with very few exceptions, simply not attached to cards powerful enough to make them worthwhile. Masques was pretty decently balanced, with a few exceptions (Squee begged to be abused from day 1), but overall, I'd say that the block has been fairly poor. Better than what came before it (Urza's Block, Tempest Block) by far, but it's like comparing being kneed in the groin repeatedly to simply being punched in the face; both are bad, but after being kneed in the groin enough, being punched in the face doesn't look so bad.

All I want to see...please, Wizards, hear my plea...is a continuation of the balance level we've found in Invasion and Planeshift. Keep it comin'...
 
M

magicman_moe

Guest
whats the deal with gold cards man?
what do they represent and why are they made?
just thought id ask kinda seems like a wasted of good cardboard when they could be reprinting something cool hehehe
 
Z

Zadok001

Guest
Istanbul said:

"We'll also lose such perfectly balanced cards as Parallax Wave, Blastoderm, and other irritating cards that are simply way too good."

And Duel responded:

"Perfectly balanced cards such as blastoderm?

ROFLMAO!"

/me points to dripping sarcasm.
 
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