99 Ways to Kill Spiritmonger

M

Mars

Guest
http://www.angelfire.com/sd/priorities/killmonger.html

That's a webpage I started to help/ask The Magic Community to share ways of bringing down the new Apocalypse Rare, Spiritmonger. The card's fairly broken, but is beatable.

It tore through the first day of Apocalypse Pre-Release Sealed based on the reports I'm getting.

Toby Wachter taught me through his excellent prose not to fear creatures. Before he did so I lived in fear and lost to Masticore quite often, afterwards, I learned not to fear the Kitty but beat up on it nearly always. Monger will be a tad harder to kill but it's doable. It will slightly change all our boards and maindecks a bit, but we can do it.

Feel free to post your favorte new T2 (JulyOct01) Monger decks here then I'm sure others of us will be happy to tell you how we'll beat you. :) Enjoy. It's a "Brave New World," for sure.
 

Ransac

CPA Trash Man
In hawaii. Just thought of a way to kill Spiritmonger.

Pick up the card, light it on fire, piss on the ashes, rub the ashes on your body, and sing while the asylum carts you away.


Ransac, cpa trash man
 
M

Mars

Guest
Although I find the idea of urinating in ashes personally appealing, WHY go to all that much trouble? Just ask to see the card, say "look at that gorgeous couple!", and when he turns around scratch a big SM on the back of the sleeve and call the judge over to look at the marked card! Oh, wait. That would be cheating, and good casual players like ourselves never do that, right? I certainly hope not.

Here's a Spiritmonger "core" deck to get you started. I have some Wizards links I added to the bottom of my page yesterday, the first of which tells you how to cast a 2nd turn Monger. You'll probably need to have these cards:

4 Llanowar Elves
4 Birds of Paradise
4 Dark Ritual
4 Spiritmonger
some other cards
some lands, including 4 of the B/G painlands Llanowar Wastes
 
A

arhar

Guest
If you hate the card that much, here's a way: trade for as much as you can in your area, and then make a campfire out of them Mongers :)
 
M

Mars

Guest
But the Hunt Brothers tried cornering the silver market once and that just blew up in their faces, so, no. The campfire thing is good, though. :)

I don't hate it as much as I hate the idea of every little kid being cheated out of stuff to trade for them. I wrote my page as a public service to try to undo some of that damage. And don't tell me "bad trades" are a good learning experience for the kids. So is being fair and doing the right thing and that's the way I choose to operate.

Well, getting back to a Monger deck, what else can be put in besides Mongers and Speed cards? There are many different stragegies here, so experiment with Scutas, Jade Leeches, Black creature destruction, perhaps some maindeck anti-enchantment stuff, and some way of accelerating through your deck. I have a ton of ideas but throw something out here and let's see if we salute it or fire away. Take a chance! After all if you can't stand the heat then stay out of the kitchen, as they say.
 
M

Mars

Guest
4 Llanowar Elves
4 Birds of Paradise
4 Dark Ritual
4 Spiritmonger
8 other Regenerators. Which?
4 Pernicious Deed
3 Creeping Mold
2 Rhystic Tutor
3 Dark Banishing
4 Llanowar Wastes
10 forests
10 swamps

Pernicious Deed has to be the most feminine name of a card in Magic, IMO. They should have called it Phyrexian Disk. Oh well.
 
R

rkoelsch

Guest
you could put spectral lynx's in they would work well against mirror decks.
 
S

Slug man

Guest
I have splashed green into my R.B IBC deck. I now use Spiritmonger as a kill card, with Skizzik and Pernicious Deed to destroy enchantments, and other stuff. Now over half the deck destroys stuff :). That includes land.

Please tell me how to kill the mighty monger, so I know how to protect him from any vicious assasination attempts.
 
M

Mikeymike

Guest
This is why WOTC should have printed the lovely Humble in 7th, but alas...

Arrest, Hobble, and other pacifiers will work.

Reprisal maindeck? Are you mad? Its not like big creatures are in 80% of the deck nowadays...oh wait, they are.

Chump block and then Scorching Lava with kicker.

Backlash and Delerium won't kill it but they will piss off your opponent.

ORDER/chaos, you remove 1 from the game and your opponent will fear playing a 2nd monger.

Plague Wind, but by the time you get to 9 mana you'll probably be dead.

Dominate

Collective Restraint, War Tax, Ensnaring Bridge.

Cho-manno

Zippo
 
M

Mars

Guest
Lots of good ideas, guys. I finally made it to 99 ways, BTW.
MikeyMike, you get full credit for your cool ideas.

BTW, I wish you folks would help me tune the deck I listed. Yah, I like Spectral Lynx a whole bunch, but I'm paranoid going to three colors when I can get away with two. Color screw, especially in an era with Rishadan Port, is one of my pet peeves.

As far as the 8 missing creatures are concerned, I'm considering Jade Leech and Blastoderm. They are not regenerators, and they top heavy the deck, but they're definitely threats. Then again, don't discount Drudge Skeletons to smooth the mana curve. Plus we have new Disk (Deed?), and Regens + Disk was once a very awesome archetype when you could play with Uthden Troll, etc.

My feeling is that we should co-design a really nasty Monger deck, as nasty as it can be, to better our defensive stategy against it, and so then finally put it to rest. I hope. We may be casual, but we're not dumb. We can do this.
 
M

Mikeymike

Guest
Sift through a few decks on the CPA, there are 2 in particular w/in the last 10 days or so you should look at to get some ideas.

Superguy posted a G/B deck that uses Mongers and Deeds. Solid deck thats pretty self-explanatory when you see it.

Foundation of Rancor posted a fun B/W/G deck that's very creature lite and uses Necra Santuary as the kill. Its different in principle but being that they would the same color scheme you might be able to share a few ideas.

Other strong regenerating creatures to look at:
Charging Troll
Chilling Aparition (but I'd run the Spectral Lynx first)

I wouldn't be worried about going 3 color, thats why you play Birds. But you must get the Pain lands if you want to make a real effort. If the Port is a problem you'll have access to Tsabo's Web in the sideboard.

Diabolic Intent I'm finding is a much better Tutor than the Rhystic. I've tried the Rhystic in about 3 decks and 14 or so draws with my being able to cast it about 4 times. I slipped the Intent into a little Recursion/Mass Destruction deck of mine, worked perfectly. Besides, your little mana critters are going to bite the bullet anyway when the Deed is read.

And I've always like discard backup to the Disk, it should work the same with the Deed. That new BW (Gerrard's Verdict?) discard spell is extremely strong along with Duress and Bog Down too. Something to consider.

You've got time to turn this into a winning deck and a huge new card pool to work with.
 
M

Mars

Guest
Thank you, MikeyMike. That's very helpful. Mike Mason has an excellent as usual article up today (Thurs, May31, 2001) at Star City with the usual lifespan of one day (that is NOT The Ferrett's fault, BTW - it's Management's policy). I'll list the deck, then the link to the article, which I hope you would consider as required reading.

//NAME: Indian Summer

Creatures(6)
3x Nether Spirit
3x Spiritmonger

Other Spells(30)
4x Phyrexian Arena
3x Restock
4x Death Grasp
4x Pernicious Deed
4x Duress
3x Sterling Grove
4x Vindicate
4x Gerrard's Verdict

Land(24)
4x Forest
4x Llanowar Wastes
2x Caves of Koilos
4x Plains
2x Elfhame Palace
2x City of Brass
6x Swamp

Sideboard(15)
3x Cremate
3x Tsabo’s Web
3x Massacre
3x Persecute
3x Spectral Lynx

See Mike's article by clicking on the following:
http://www.starcitygames.com/php/news/expandnews.php?Article=1475
 
F

Firestorm

Guest
Putting Spirit Link on it. better yet two so if it attacks, you gain life rater than lose life. Pacifism is better though. Millstone might hit it. Zodiac Dragon, Wall of Nets, Sol'KAnar the Swamp King(get 1 life and Swampwalk your opponent to death), Overtaker, Capsize, Nicol Bolas, and also Urborg Skeleton. Sacred Mesa is nice for bloking forever.
 
I

Istanbul

Guest
Worship.
Security Detail.
Kjeldoran Outpost.
Hobble.
Wrath.
Arrest.
Pacifism.
Exile.
Order/Chaos.
Swords to Plowshares.
Cho-Manno, Revolutionary.
Ivory Gargoyle.
Peacekeeper.

...and that's just the white stuff.

Nevermind that Ensnaring Bridge, which I expect to see a lot more of, basically stops this guy cold.
 
D

Dead

Guest
Hm, most of those solutions on the page mentioned can't get around regeneration. Anyone else remember Furnace Brood? Hill Giant with R: target creature cannot regenerate this turn.

Other ways to stop regeneration would be City of Solitude or Cursed Totem, sure the ability is still there but try activating it...

My personal favourite? Smack it with Pit Spawn...
 
M

Mars

Guest
Thanks, guys. Your recommendations are duly noted and will make it onto my page with due credit. We may get to 200 ways before we're through.

Yes, that "regeneration thing" is troublesome, no? Just remember that Scorching Lava is still popular as anti-Nether Spirit technology and works well when combined with other DD's, blockers etc. to remove the mighty Monger.

By many accounts BW is strongest, but Fires is still around, as is Orb/Opposition, and Ensnaring Bridge as has been noted, and a patient player has been known to work the Islands and Plains long enough to cast a Wrath of God or Rout.

Spiritmonger technology is still in its infancy, and it remains to be seen where it will finally settle. To save you the trouble of going to the top of this post, here is the link again with interesting quotes by Randy Buehler, Vasco Da Gama, and Nate Heiss. Seems the card is still quite contraversial.

http://www.angelfire.com/sd/priorities/killmonger.html
 
M

Mars

Guest
Cool. The Ferrett puts my page up at Star City, and I get 1000 hits in one day. Of course I put your guys' stuff in. Up to 170 ways, and more to come......
 
I

Istanbul

Guest
ICE AGE / ALLIANCES:

Ashen Ghoul
(and it's good in a deck, too!)

Binding Grasp
(I'll take that, thank you...)

Blinking Spirit
(Crunch all you want, we'll make more!)

Bone Shaman
(Block with Bone Shaman, Bolt the Monger, activate the Shaman's ability. Regenerate? NO.)

Caribou Range
(A m00se once bit my sister)

Elder Druid
(Spiritmonger can't attack if he's tapped...)

Giant Trap Door Spider
(Out of the game with you!)

Goblin Snowman
(for that humiliation effect)

Icy Manipulator
(See also Elder Druid)

Icy Prison
(Shoo!)

Jester's Cap
(Can't cast the Monger if he's not in your deck!)

Jokulhaups
(Die, Monger, die!)

Merieke Ri Berit
(Mine!)

Minion of Leshrac
(He's big, he's beefy, he's got prot. black.)

Order of the Ebon Hand
(Protection from black stops this guy cold.)

Pit Trap
(Hey, look! It's in Type 2!)

Wall of Pine Needles
(Spiritmonger, regeneration 0wnz j00)

Yavimaya Gnats
(See above)

Contagion
(Okay, it's not dead, but a 2/4 is a lot easier to stomach...)

Gorilla Chieftain
(Two, four, six, eight! This guy can regenerate!)

Helm of Obedience
(Gimme!)

Ivory Gargoyle
(...but I already said that.)

Lim-Dul's High Guard
(First strike AND regenerate!)

Reprisal
(Type 2 smackdown!)

Ritual of the Machine
(Black Control Magic!)

...and that's just the Ice Age block stuff.
 
M

Mars

Guest
Well, that's the way it started out, Spiderman.

Spiritmonger, IMO, loses value as the card pool increases, and loses it rapidly. For example, here is my opinion of it in the various formats:

Limited - Incredible
IBC Block Constructed - Very Good
Type Two - Good
Type 1.x Extended - Average to Above Average, depending on the Extended season, and we have no idea as of yet how future 1.x seasons will go until we see Odyssey and friends.
Type 1.5 - Bad
Type One - Horrible, because Type One has so many better creatures available to it, and every way out there to kill Monger.

But looking at just Type Two, I think the very presence of this thing in the environment will increase the value of Wrath of God, Terminate, and yes, Scorching Lava. In fact, I'll be fine tuning my mono-red deck for the upcoming "Whee! 3 color Decks!" season (I so do not like color screw), and you can be sure I'll be maindecking Lavas, which have "some" utility vs Nether Spirit as well, which isn't going anywhere. Currently my favorite deck is MagpieOrbOpposition, as played at German Nationals by Mello and Luhrs. That will work, I hope. And everyone's touting B/W. We'll see.
 
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